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September 22, 2011
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Maybe selling at RIAis the OPs best option. They seem to get top dollar even for problematic firearms.
January 8, 2025
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mrcvs said
Maybe selling at RIAis the OPs best option. They seem to get top dollar even for problematic firearms.
A couple people with more money than brain will fight over it on the regular monthly sale. It would probably be listed as professionally refinished and nothing else. It’s a shame. That was a great riffle for someone starting out buying original Winchesters. I like RIA. Their staff are great people.
March 20, 2009
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Blue Ridge Parson said
I suspect that others here have noticed what I have noticed, and that is there exists a surprisingly large market for guns that have been re-finished, restored, or upgraded. Some number of buyers seem quite willing to pay a pretty penny for such guns. So while the purist collector may not desire such a rifle, there are still people out there who do. How many times has the lament been raised here about a gun at auction, obviously not original (and sometimes acknowledged as such in the auction description) that has sold for a much higher amount than seemed reasonable here at WACA ? I have lost count of such instances. All of which is to say that there is indeed a market for rifles such as the OP shows above. It may not appeal to thee or me, but someone out there does buy these rifles.
BRP
I pretty much totally agree and do not “look down” on someone who buys and enjoys what they can afford of desire. That is why there are Fords, Chevies, VW’s and blonds and redheads in the world. Not everyone has the luxury of a LOT of free time to learn as much as some collectors and that may lead to them relying on descriptions and getting burned at times. THAT is regretful for sure. I thinks that sometimes there is too much emphasis on collecting as being a money making hobby. Often times that is a maybe at best.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
December 9, 2002
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Well said, once again, Michael!
Tony
November 7, 2015
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I’m not opposed to restoration or aggressive maintenance in some limited cases and like BRP I know there is a market for these pieces. My issue is the work was poorly done, IMHO. Just my opinion; not my money, not my gun, not my call. Besides, I liked what I saw in the “before” pictures. I know a lower condition gun is hard to sell in today’s market but I don’t think the work done will help sell the gun. Sad situation.
Mike
April 30, 2023
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There’s a YouTube channel where they do “restorations” on guns and they often look staged at best. They recently did a Winchester rifle (it was in bad shape) and the outcome was horrible. I wrote to them and asked them to please not do that to any more Winchesters. I’m sure they told me to get bent. 
Yes, in this case, I’m with you all, I liked the original. Crazy how advantageous it is to have folks like TwoBit and all others who keep meticulous records…
November 19, 2006
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MidwestCrisis said
mrcvs said
Maybe selling at RIAis the OPs best option. They seem to get top dollar even for problematic firearms.
A couple people with more money than brain will fight over it on the regular monthly sale. It would probably be listed as professionally refinished and nothing else. It’s a shame. That was a great riffle for someone starting out buying original Winchesters. I like RIA. Their staff are great people.
This has been an interesting discussion – many valid perspectives.
I agree with the above statement and have countless times observed where an altered piece will sell for a dramatically larger amount than I would have thought In some of these instances you can see two bidders slugging it out and the driving force appears to be an ego-driven need to win.
More money than knowledge is a common theme as well. Add in too much ego and it can be quite the win for a seller. I think one of the most valuable traits in life is the ability to recognize one’s limitations. We can’t all know everything and be great at everything. I’ve seen many who refuse to accept this. I suppose this is where the phrase, “blinded by ego” comes in.
March 20, 2009
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steve004 said
I think one of the most valuable traits in life is the ability to recognize one’s limitations. We can’t all know everything and be great at everything. I’ve seen many who refuse to accept this. I suppose this is where the phrase, “blinded by ego” comes in.
That is SOOOO correct!! And to have the humility to recognize it.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
September 22, 2011
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Hands down, you are better off with a pristine piece, 98 to 100%, except when you have doubters who believe that it might be refinished. 85 to 97% used to be a good place to be, but not anymore. I think there’s a stronger demand, and possible valuation on a refinished piece than something in the 75 to 95 or 97% range, as long as well done and in the lower percentages of this range.
November 19, 2006
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mrcvs said
Hands down, you are better off with a pristine piece, 98 to 100%, except when you have doubters who believe that it might be refinished. 85 to 97% used to be a good place to be, but not anymore. I think there’s a stronger demand, and possible valuation on a refinished piece than something in the 75 to 95 or 97% range, as long as well done and in the lower percentages of this range.
I too, have seen evidence of trends in this direction. This doesn’t fit well with me, finding that the place I am in, is no longer that, “good place to be.” Even though many of my pieces may be worth less than they used to be worth, I don’t like them any less. And I’m not going to switch to refinished or restored rifles.
While my focus is on original pieces, I do see an enormous distinction between a poor restoration (such as the topic rifle of this thread) vs. a top notch restoration such as Wyoming Armory or Turnbull turns out. In fact, anything short of a Wyoming Armory or Turnbull quality restoration, is in my book, a “poor restoration.” Top restored pieces can sell for big dollars, but that doesn’t mean the sellers are making money on them. The cost of a quality restoration easily takes my breath away.
April 15, 2005
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mrcvs said
Hands down, you are better off with a pristine piece, 98 to 100%, except when you have doubters who believe that it might be refinished. 85 to 97% used to be a good place to be, but not anymore. I think there’s a stronger demand, and possible valuation on a refinished piece than something in the 75 to 95 or 97% range, as long as well done and in the lower percentages of this range.
I disagree. In my personal opinion, Winchester firearms that are in the 80 – 95% condition range will always be very desirable collector’s pieces, and very easy to sell without losing any money on them. There are simply way too many of the guns in the alleged 96 – 100% range that are not what they are advertised to be. I will stick to buying guns that wear their age appropriately.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
May 2, 2009
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I agree with Bert. When you inspect an upper 90% gun, it’s a lot harder to tell if it real or not. Your looking for the signs of aging finish to see if its old finish but when you can’t see age, your wondering what you have. When I see the deteriorated finish which is very hard to fake, I know I’m safe.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
November 19, 2006
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Bert and Bob –
I agree with you and found your comments reassuring. However, I think Ian is on to something as, like he has, I’ve observed some market price drops that seem like a trend. Maybe not. I hope they are just anomalies.
September 22, 2011
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steve004 said
Bert and Bob –
I agree with you and found your comments reassuring. However, I think Ian is on to something as, like he has, I’ve observed some market price drops that seem like a trend. Maybe not. I hope they are just anomalies.
I hope so as well, but it seems to be a trend. I’ll use this rifle as an example. Multiple folks thought the $5800 price to be fair, it’s an 85% rifle, I negotiated down a bit from the asking price. This was about a year and a half ago. I found something I liked better, and decided to let this one go, thinking, at auction, it would do quite well and I might make perhaps 10% on it as I negotiated my terms downward as to what I might have to pay.
https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-swap-meet/886-ex-lt-c-1909-for-sale/
Morphy’s is a well respected auction house, but I probably should have let it go at Rock Island. The key points here are I bought it before the Election of 2024 and sold it after the election, when this sort of stuff tumbled 10 to 33%. If I had known how poorly it would fare, I never would have gotten rid of it. I didn’t dislike it, just thought it would do well, thinking $7500 at auction wasn’t a stretch.
And here’s how it fared:
I get it this is one example, but I’ve found other such examples and this rifle shouldn’t have fared so poorly.
September 22, 2011
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Here’s another example. Post #8, SRC in .32-40, listed here for $6500. I wanted it badly, but not at that price. It was moved to Gunbroker, the land of overpriced firearms, or so I thought. Much to my delight, somehow the last day it was below 2k. I placed a few bids back and forth and, ended up with it. After all fees, I still had it in the mid 2s, this includes shipping, sales tax, etc.
Perhaps I made back my loss on that 1886 with this one, but maybe not. Perhaps it is only a $2500 firearm, or at least was in March 2025 when purchased off of Gunbroker.
April 15, 2005
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Both times our MAGA El Presidente was elected, guns and ammo prices fell dramatically, including collectable firearms. Not sure why that was the case, but it certainly happened.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
September 22, 2011
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Bert H. said
Both times our MAGA El Presidente was elected, guns and ammo prices fell dramatically, including collectable firearms. Not sure why that was the case, but it certainly happened.
Bert
Exactly, that’s precisely my point. Right after the Election of 2024 almost everything, if not everything, in the firearms collecting community dropped 10 to 33%. This hitting particularly hard the 75 to 95% range stuff particularly hard. More resilient was the restored stuff, there never seemed to be much of a market for that stuff and now there is. Folks who are more interested in aesthetics over originality.
August 7, 2021
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I reckon with a Pres and administration, favorable to firearms ….there is no urgency to buy.
I have NOT seen the collectable firearms prices affected much. At least not what I have been buying.
Just my observation.
November 8, 2011
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Is this still available?
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