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March 31, 2009
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I loaded the 6 cases and will shoot them tomorrow. I have a lot of FFFg and not so much FFg so I have using some of each when loading the 45 grains. About a 50/50 mixture. Hopefully the 2nd fire forming will be enough. If these don’t all come out with the same measurements I will shoot them a 3rd time. I’ve been robbing bullets from some 38-55 rounds and then sanding them to length/weight. I need to make my jig a bit more user friendly since nobody makes 38 Cal .380″ 215 grain bullets. It would be nice to safely cut these with the radial arm saw. Believe me carbide tipped blades will cut all non ferrous metals easily and with no harm to the blade. I just need a better way to hold the bullets while doing so.
March 31, 2009
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Shot the 6 cases. Some still have a few small dimples. Next time I’m going to increase the powder charge to 75%. I am also going to use a larger diameter bullet. The case mouth is too large now for the bullets and I don’t have a way to size the neck. I’m starting to get leakage. I had been using the smallest of the 3 diameters I have, .376″. Next time I will use some .380″. Now I get to clean the rifle. Man, do I hate cleaning black powder.
March 31, 2009
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Last night I had some free time so I prepared the cases for primers and powder. I cut the bullets with the radial arm saw. Way easier and faster. Then I beveled the bottom edge of the bullets. I also mixed some FFg and FFFg. I don’t have a lot of FFg but have too much FFFg. I cut the filler wads to length. Everything is done so I’m ready to load the cartridges. Dirty rifle is still sitting there.
April 15, 2005
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Chuck said
Last night I had some free time so I prepared the cases for primers and powder. I cut the bullets with the radial arm saw. Way easier and faster. Then I beveled the bottom edge of the bullets. I also mixed some FFg and FFFg. I don’t have a lot of FFg but have too much FFFg. I cut the filler wads to length. Everything is done so I’m ready to load the cartridges. Dirty rifle is still sitting there.
Why not load them with IMR 4198 ? Clean the rifle real good, and then load & shoot with the smokeless powder going forward.
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
March 31, 2009
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Bert H. said
Chuck said
Last night I had some free time so I prepared the cases for primers and powder. I cut the bullets with the radial arm saw. Way easier and faster. Then I beveled the bottom edge of the bullets. I also mixed some FFg and FFFg. I don’t have a lot of FFg but have too much FFFg. I cut the filler wads to length. Everything is done so I’m ready to load the cartridges. Dirty rifle is still sitting there.
Why not load them with IMR 4198 ? Clean the rifle real good, and then load & shoot with the smokeless powder going forward.
After I get done fire forming I plan to use IMR 4198. I don’t get the best results when using the 4198 for fire forming. I tried this when I was forming the 45 EX cases. The cases just don’t turn out formed as smoothly. I had a little less of the same problem when I used smokeless when forming the Lee Navy cases. I’m hoping my next firing will be my last fire forming.
After thinking more about this I’m going to shoot a full charge of black powder. I went to the reduced loads because I was splitting cases on the first firing. Now that almost all the forming is done I doubt any of the cases will split.
March 31, 2009
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Cleaned the rifle. Took about a half hour. The picture on the bottom is after my first pass with a brush. Ran the brush back and forth a few more times but most of the loose stuff came out on the first pass. The top picture is all of the patches I used to get the remaining black powder out. There are 12 patches below the cleaning rod handle. These were ran through the barrel dry and each side of the patch was used. On the left there are some bits of patches that I use as a backer to make the patch fit tighter. As the cleaning goes so does the size of the backer. The bottom row is where I used a barrel flush. I ran the one on the left with the flush then ran the rest going from left to right. Once the patches started coming out dry I started using both sides of the patch.
April 15, 2005
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Chuck said
Cleaned the rifle. Took about a half hour. The picture on the bottom is after my first pass with a brush. Ran the brush back and forth a few more times but most of the loose stuff came out on the first pass. The top picture is all of the patches I used to get the remaining black powder out. There are 12 patches below the cleaning rod handle. These were ran through the barrel dry and each side of the patch was used. On the left there are some bits of patches that I use as a backer to make the patch fit tighter. As the cleaning goes so does the size of the backer. The bottom row is where I used a barrel flush. I ran the one on the left with the flush then ran the rest going from left to right. Once the patches started coming out dry I started using both sides of the patch.
And that is exactly why I never load or shoot black powder cartridges in ANY of my old Winchesters!! If I had to load and shoot the shells a dozen times or more with 4198 to get them fire formed, I would do it versus just 2 or 3 cycles with black powder. I very strongly detest cleaning up the black powder residue, and not just the rifle… you also have to clean the empty shell cases.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
March 31, 2009
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Bert H. said
And that is exactly why I never load or shoot black powder cartridges in ANY of my old Winchesters!! If I had to load and shoot the shells a dozen times or more with 4198 to get them fire formed, I would do it versus just 2 or 3 cycles with black powder. I very strongly detest cleaning up the black powder residue, and not just the rifle… you also have to clean the empty shell cases.
Bert
I soak the cases in a jar full of soapy water, shaking periodically. The next day I rinse them with hot water. Primer pockets need to be done before the soak. If wet you’ll end up with a gooey mess. That’s why I spend the time removing as much of the dry residue in the barrel before I flush it out. I have fire formed cases with smokeless right from the start. But it does not work as well on these very long high volume cases. I seem to be able to control the pressure better with the black powder. I have a handful of Colt percussion pistols that I have never shot just because of the issues with black powder.
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