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Chuck said
https://www.morphyauctions.com/jamesdjulia/wp-content/uploads/images/auctions/397/prov/52176a2.PDF
Reading this account hastily, I overlooked the story of Slotterbeck’s employer in Frisco, gun dealer A.J. Plate, who was an exceptionally enterprising crook: after being sued by John Deringer for the counterfeit Deringer pistols he had been selling (made by Slotterbeck), he pays off an unrelated John Deringer also in Philly for the use of his name on these pistols! Goes to show you can’t keep a determined crook down. If he was alive today he might well be a highly rated seller on Gunbroker.
Michael Petrov had some tidbits:
“For the ones not up on the Slotterbek family Charles was killed in 1886 when a live shell he was de-priming exploded.”
“Henry was killed in 1888 when he was at the range with Wundhammer while standing in front of a rifle while adjusting the front sight.”
Also:
I’ll be darn Henry Slotterbek (Slotterbeck) had a son who carried on in the business…I did not know that.
Los Angeles, California City Directories, 1888-90 about Henry Slotterbeck
Name: Henry Slotterbeck
Location 1: 111 North Main
Location 2: 120 Buena Vista
Occupation: guns and ammunition
Year: 1890
City: Los Angeles
State: CA
A fellow named Terry Buffram mentions he has a Model 1886 done by Henry (this is 10 years ago):
Does anyone have a post 1888 and therefore Henry Slotterbek (Jr) marked rifle? I have two by the father, one an ’86 Winchester, the other a Remington Rolling block shotgun action made into a rifle. I also have a percussion double rifle by his Uncle Charles.
Here’s the whole thread for anyone interested:
https://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=242690&page=1
steve004 said
Michael Petrov had some tidbits:“For the ones not up on the Slotterbek family Charles was killed in 1886 when a live shell he was de-priming exploded.”
“Henry was killed in 1888 when he was at the range with Wundhammer while standing in front of a rifle while adjusting the front sight.”
Mike merely repeated the same newspaper story, uncritically; hammer guns don’t go off “accidentally” unless cocked, so the idea of an experienced shooter putting himself directly in front of the muzzle of a cocked rifle in order to tamper with the front sight suggests some details of the accident are missing.
Errol, I personally find the story of the Slotterbecks or Slotterbeks, to be quite interesting, especially as it has evolved with the tid bits of info interjected along the way. There is quite the diverse group of people in the WACA organization, and many but not all, frequent the forum. I suspect there are those whose absence from the forum leave this story line sagging some, though. As to the two brother’s deaths, it brings to mind the mantra of the Army center for accident prevention (the Aviation center and school) that there are no accidents–only human mistakes. And ALL of those are preventable. As to our critiques of the rifle, that was initially what was presented for comment, so you should take those in the manner in which they were offered. That is what we know. It would have really helped if you had asked if members had further info on the Slotterbecks and their deaths, etc. Tim
clarence said
steve004 said
Michael Petrov had some tidbits:
“For the ones not up on the Slotterbek family Charles was killed in 1886 when a live shell he was de-priming exploded.”
“Henry was killed in 1888 when he was at the range with Wundhammer while standing in front of a rifle while adjusting the front sight.”Mike merely repeated the same newspaper story, uncritically; hammer guns don’t go off “accidentally” unless cocked, so the idea of an experienced shooter putting himself directly in front of the muzzle of a cocked rifle in order to tamper with the front sight suggests some details of the accident are missing.
Hmmm… well, reportedly Wundhammer was standing right there… more competition between them than we were aware of? An attractive spouse in the mix….?
steve004 said
Hmmm… well, reportedly Wundhammer was standing right there… more competition between them than we were aware of? An attractive spouse in the mix….?
Well, he took over the business afterwards. But if you were Wundhamer & accidentally shot your employer with no other witnesses present, what would you tell the coroner? (Axel Peterson accidentally shot a customer, but witnesses were present.) Who would be helped by the “truth”? Certainly not the victim. That’s speculation, but the alleged facts as presented strain credulity–not absolutely impossible, but at best far-fetched.
As for the average veracity of newspaper stories, many reported in 1903 that Annie Oakley had been arrested for drug addiction. Of course it was a lie trumped up to sell newspapers, but it took Annie years & a fortune in legal expenses to clear her name. Then there’s MSN; believe what’s reported there?
The only known Winchester 1886 customized by Henry Slotterbek
Back in the mid 1800’s there were at least three Slotterbek brothers. They immigrated to the United States from Wurttemberg, Germany. They were all from a family of gunsmiths. All were most highly skilled. Two of them went to work for Henry Derringer on his famous pistol in Philidelpha, PA. After some time they split up and Charles (the elder) moved to San Francisco CA. There he set up his gun shop and was closely aligned with A.J. Plate an arms dealer in San Francisco. Later Henry and Fredrick moved to California as well. Henry set up his shop in Los Angels where he customized many rifles for some of the most important men of that time. Both Charles and Henry were quite famous gunsmiths of the era. Fredrick died before he really became as famous as his brothers. Charles had a number of patents on various items, such as the first three-barrel rifle/shotgun combination gun, double set triggers and shooting glasses. He also patented scope mounts that were used to mount Malcolm scopes on many different rifles. In 1869, Henry moved to Los Angeles and was employed by Henry Schaffer who was a pioneer gunsmith in Los Angeles. In 1872 Henry Slotterbek purchased Shaffer’s business known as “The Sportsman’s Emporium” that was located on Los Angeles Street.
One fine bright and sunny day in June, Henry Slotterbek, as part of his gunsmithing business, was targeting three rifles at the local range. One belonged to Judge Anson Brunson. After firing two shots he found that the front sight was in need of adjustment. Taking out his brass punch and brass hammer he proceeded to tap the sight base. While adjusting the sight, he apparently stood in front of the loaded rifle, which was lying in a horizontal position on the shooting bench. The rifle discharged, hitting him in the chest. He died quickly. In witness of all of this was his assistant gunsmith, the later well-known Ludwig Wadhammer. Henry died on June 21, 1888. Strangely Henry’s brother, the well-known Charles Slotterbek was killed in a freak accident two years before, in 1886. He was unloading a cartridge and somehow the primer went off sending the base of the case into his forehead. He seemed to be recovering, but the next day he passed out and died, his skull had been damaged by the accident.
Now for the mystery: I recently came in possession of a Winchester, 1886 that had been customized by Henry Slotterbek. His markings are on the octagon portion of the half round, half octagon barrel. Stamped on the left rear portion of the of the barrel is .45 GOV. The barrel is sleeved. It has a folding peep sight on the rear and a Lyman Beech folding sight on the front. This rifle is almost in mint condition and is about 130 years old, it has not been refinished. I found that Terry Buffin from OR once owned it, he had some fame in the racecar circuit. I would love to know where he got this rifle so we can perhaps trace it back. So, where is the mystery? What possible explanation could there be for a rifle this old to still be in almost mint condition? My thoughts are as follows: This could be the same rifle that killed Henry Slotterbek. Why, you ask? If such a thing happened would it be logical to retire the weapon? Perhaps the family just put it away so they wouldn’t be reminded of his death by seeing it. After a great deal of research. I believe that this rifle is the only Winchester customized by Henry Slotterbek. As he had died less than two years after the introduction of this model, he most likely would not have been very familiar with it. He mostly dealt with single shot rifles so being distracted by the sight problem, he may have not realized that he had chambered another round after he levered and shot the first two. Also, this rifle has a double set trigger, which is much easier to fire than the standard trigger. So there you have it, we most likely may never know exactly what really happened, but if you can find another 86 by Slotterbek please let me know!
Errol D. Severe
I tried to upload the article from the LA Times for about an hour. Can’t get it to upload. Sorry.
Well, there it is but can’t figure how to make it large enough to read. It’s five inches wide in photoshop. I just tried clicking on it and it came through large enough to read! Go figure!
ERROL SEVERE said
Had no trouble enlarging & reading this; thanks for posting it. The last sentence explains my skepticism about how the accident actually happened. Seems no one thought Wundhamer serving as bullet spoter was a concern!
ERROL SEVERE said
He mostly dealt with single shot rifles so being distracted by the sight problem, he may have not realized that he had chambered another round after he levered and shot the first two.
It’s possible to “forget” you’ve left a hammerless action, like a Sharps Borchardt or Savage 99, cocked & ready to fire, but the cocked hammer of an ’86 is no less obvious a warning than that of a SS. That he might have been using a “brass punch & hammer” is plausible, but is not supported by the scant evidence.
ERROL SEVERE said
Also, this rifle has a double set trigger, which is much easier to fire than the standard trigger.
That’s not quite how a set triggers work, you have to set it in order for it to be light, and only a true idiot would set a trigger with a loaded chamber and then step in front of the muzzle.
I agree the rifle is interesting and neat to look at and imagine what was, but with out provenance, it’s just another modified rifle with a “story”, to me at least.
impalacustom said
I agree the rifle is interesting and neat to look at and imagine what was, but with out provenance, it’s just another modified rifle with a “story”, to me at least.
But it does have a marked Slotterbeck brl, which makes it rather unique. “Judge Brunson” was said to be the owner of the gun, so a search for his history would be the start of establishing provenance.
Terry Buffum said he sold the Model 1886 bout five years ago at an Amoskeag auction. Did Merz purchase it there? I couldn’t find it but I did find this Slotterbek custom Rolling Block that sold at the Amoskeag auction in 2015. The auction description mentions it is out of Terry’s collection. He mentions this rifle in the Double Gun thread I posted earlier.
I assume Merz owned the rifle and as I speculated above, perhaps he was the one to purchase it at an Amoskeag auction. In fact, the photos shown of the rifle must be Merz’s photos. I think many of us recognized the signature green carpet.
steve004 said
I assume Merz owned the rifle and as I speculated above, perhaps he was the one to purchase it at an Amoskeag auction. In fact, the photos shown of the rifle must be Merz’s photos. I think many of us recognized the signature green carpet.
If it was sold by Merz, he’s probably the source of the “almost mint” description…which is not true, unfortunately.
I am not going to knock this rifle. It is not as manufactured but was modified by a well respected gunsmith. Many guns had the same modifications done in the period. A lot were re barreled for target shooting. The purest won’t like it but it has a story and it is not a made up story. I suggest you read the Sharps book by Frank Sellers. You will see Slotterbek, Carlos Gove, Freund and J.P. Lower guns pictured from some of the finest collections. Dealers and gunsmiths marked their guns. Some may bring a premium to the right collector.
This gun has provenance.
I recall the Slotterbek name now with regard to scopes. Here’s one:
https://witherells.com/lot/1873-winchester-rifle-with-slotterbek-telescopic-sight-4081300
This was from Henry’s brother, Charles. Who, tragically, was the brother who was killed in 1886 when a live shell he was depriming exploded. Very strange that both brother’s were killed in freakish firearms related accidents.
Interesting that this rifle/scope was discussed here six months ago:
This is somewhat unrelated to your topic but I have an old drilling inscribed by Henry Slotterbeck dedicated to his brother Charles Slotterbeck. It actually has both of their names on the same gun!
Steven Carney said
This is somewhat unrelated to your topic but I have an old drilling inscribed by Henry Slotterbeck dedicated to his brother Charles Slotterbeck. It actually has both of their names on the same gun!
Obviously a unique & historically significant firearm, except that interest in drillings isn’t exactly boiling over in this country. Not to mention the general level of ignorance about the Slotterbeck family. Here’s a forum where appreciation for such unusual guns may be greater: https://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php
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