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Having both the curiosity of a raccoon and an inability to leave well enough alone, I’ve been looking into how the Herstal Group’s Browning Arms Company and its Japanese affiliate, Miroku Corporation, color case harden their deluxe versions of the Winchester rifles and carbines they make.
To anticipate and staunch any hurling of rotten tomatos from the diehard bench, the term appearing on the factory carton end labels is “CCH”, which Winchester Guns makes clear in its literature means color case hardening, not something else. That, coming from Browning with the certain prerequisite blessing of Fabrique Nationale Herstal, which itself did not exactly fall off a watermelon truck, can be safely taken to mean the process hardens the steel to which it is applied, to some extent, and is not a coloring technique only.
The process employed was developed by Tom Ivanoff of Cody Wyoming, doing business as Tom’s Gun Repair, who licensed its use to Herstal and its subsidiaries. Ivanoff’s business has been since acquired by Signal Mountain Gun Works, a Montana company.
Cutting to the chase, Ivanoff’s process employs Potassium Cyanide to carburize already heat treated steel, causing the steel to absorb and bring carbon to its surface in a manner that creates a thin, hardened outer layer that displays patterns of color, but does not interfere with the existing temper of the underlying steel.
Rather than achieving similar but deeper and more colorful (or distinguishably different) color patterns by embedding steel in its anealed state, in bone/wood charcoal, depriving it of oxygen, and heating it to 1400-1600 degrees, then quenching it in cold water. This process hardens the outer layer of the steel, while leaving its core annealed and malleable.
Note a very important difference: to employ the traditional method of color case hardening the receiver of a modern manufactured rifle, the receiver must be first reduced to its annealed state — removing all factory heat treatment. Otherwise, the steel cannot absorb sufficient carbon to color it up and harden only the outer layer.
From that, I would conclude having a modern rifle’s receiver color case hardened the “real, old fashioned way” is the equivalent of trading your high number, heat treated Springfield 1903 receiver for an original, low number, case hardened receiver. Which doesn’t sound nearly as appealing.
What am I missing here? Is it possible to further heat treat a steel receiver after it’s been bone charcoal case hardened?
I have read the Miroku Winchester receivers are made of 4140 steel heat treated and tempered to RC 38 to 42 and are subjected in that state to the Ivanoff color case hardening process, which does not degrade the temper of the steel. Which seems preferable, whether the case colors are “more fragile” or not.
After all, unless I misunderstand something, the traditional bone charcoal “deeper” hard case layer has to be deeper and harder because that’s all you got. Everything underneath is in an annealed state.
Mind you, I am not comparing the bone charcoal case hardening of 19th Century steel stock to the Ivanoff Potassium Cyanide case hardening of 4140 stock. What I’m suggesting is eliminating the through temper of 4140 steel to get “real original colors” may not be the brightest idea on the planet if you intend to shoot the rifle.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
As an engraver, it is necessary to engrave a soft receiver. Usually this means having the metal annealed which is a heat treating process. I recently engraved for a client one of the new Japanese 1873 Winchester. Naturally I was curious as to how hard the receiver was with the type of colors that were evident to signify case hardening.
Well the action was not hard at all as all I did was chemically remove the colors. The action was soft and cut very easily. So these actions with that coloring process to my mind did nothing to even create a hard skin on the metal. It was fun to engrave
Martin, Thanks and I’ll take that as from the horse’s mouth. Rockwell 40 is soft enough, although not in the annealed state, but if you can engrave it as it comes out of the box, whatever Ivanoff’s process does to it surely doesn’t make it much harder.
I think I’ve seen some of your work in the old Gun Digest, haven’t I?
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
martin rabeno said
As an engraver, it is necessary to engrave a soft receiver. Usually this means having the metal annealed which is a heat treating process. I recently engraved for a client one of the new Japanese 1873 Winchester. Naturally I was curious as to how hard the receiver was with the type of colors that were evident to signify case hardening.Well the action was not hard at all as all I did was chemically remove the colors. The action was soft and cut very easily. So these actions with that coloring process to my mind did nothing to even create a hard skin on the metal. It was fun to engrave
Martin, if you don’t mind, what chemical(s) did you employ to remove the colors on the 1873? That would be a useful thing to know — and avoid using unintentionally!
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
Bill The chemical I use is very HI-Tech Lysol Toilet Bowl Cleaner You can also use it on the Uberti’s. I think I learned of it at the Custom Shop from Bruno Pardee when I was there
Bone Charcoal must be annealed with heat.
I have had pieces shown in the Gun Digest and elsewhere Thanks for remembering
I met Bruno when he was here for a Dallas Gun Collectors show back in the Nineties.
I do remember your work quite well, now that I reflect on the subject. I’m not a collector of engraved firearms but I love to see fine work, as much as I enjoy going to MOMA and the Kimbell in FTW.
What I remember about the pieces of yours GD displayed was that they were of the few that stood up well in the company of the works of the late Jack Prudhomme, which I took as a standard of excellence.
My Winchester history has failed me. I did not know you were a Custom Shop engraver, although it doesn’t surprise me.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
Bill I did some outside engraving work for them from my own studio that Bruno had me do. This also included the 1 of 1 model 94 centennial that was auctioned off at the shot show. I loved visiting there and especially seeing the original engraving shop that was then closed. There were no longer any in house engravers there at that time
martin rabeno said
Bill I did some outside engraving work for them from my own studio that Bruno had me do. This also included the 1 of 1 model 94 centennial that was auctioned off at the shot show. I loved visiting there and especially seeing the original engraving shop that was then closed. There were no longer any in house engravers there at that time
Martin, I’ve seen only images of the 1 of 1 but the engraving is masterful. A real triumph.
Steve opened another thread to show several post-63 Winchesters, one Model 70 35 Remington that was modestly but very tastefully engraved before bluing. Was that by any chance your work?
https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/some-post-63-model-70-talk/rss/
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
No Bill I did not do that one. Not my style of scroll. Not sure who did it
November 5, 2014
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Bill-
Did you mean the 35 Whelen Model 70 in Steve’s “Post-63” thread? S/N G2381?
I know nothing about the post-63 M70 Classics and even less about factory engraving, but IIRC those “four-digit Classics” were serialized in a block assigned to the Custom Shop, starting (I think) with G0001 (???). So the GI gun would be an early Custom Shop Classic. This gun is engraved in the 70-5 pattern that was the most common pattern used when M70s were factory engraved. I do not know the timeline for the Custom Shop Classics, but Pauline Muerrle (WACA #858L) was the last in-house Winchester factory engraver and worked with USRAC until 1986. Maybe she did the GI gun???
Here’s a similar gun… According to Pauline, this one was done in Style 70-5 by (Winchester factory engraver) John Kusmit. It follows the 70-5 pattern except for the gold inlaid ram on the floor plate instead of the usual scroll (S/N 127935). This one is a 1949 vintage pre-64 M70 in 270 WCF. It was DEFINITELY NOT a factory special order (proofs are polished over so gun was engraved later) and the stock carving does not conform to a factory 21-B pattern (but was made from a factory Super Grade stock). Speculation would be that a finished but uncheckered SG stock was “expropriated” from the factory (pre-64 M70 stocks were finished before they were checkered).
Who knows??? Maybe Martin has a better idea?
Anyway, something to look at…
Lou
WACA 9519; Studying Pre-64 Model 70 Winchesters
No idea who might of actually did it. Kusmit possible but unsure. BTW the two kusmits were super nice people. They approached me early in my career when I di the Hartford show and introduced themselves. Then they sat down with me and talked about engraving Great experience
November 5, 2014
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Thank you, Martin!!!
My memory fails, but IIRC Pauline has said that all the Winchester factory engravers but one (either Joe Crowley or Jasper Salerno, I don’t remember) took on outside commissions… So my gun might (???) have been upgraded later. But I’m sure it wasn’t a factory special order… I just put up the pics to compare to the GI rifle Steve posted…
Best,
Lou
WACA 9519; Studying Pre-64 Model 70 Winchesters
Louis Luttrell said
Thank you, Martin!!!My memory fails, but IIRC Pauline has said that all the Winchester factory engravers but one (either Joe Crowley or Jasper Salerno, I don’t remember) took on outside commissions… So my gun might (???) have been upgraded later. But I’m sure it wasn’t a factory special order… I just put up the pics to compare to the GI rifle Steve posted…
Best,
Lou
Here’s an example of an engraved rifle that fits can fit into our discussion. It’s an 1886 Leroy Merz offered some decades ago:
It represents an interesting piece that collectors will feel differently about. If the story is accurate, it was engraved by well-known Winchester engravers – Nick Kusmit and Jake Salerno – who were engraving at the Winchester factory at the time they engraved the rifle. However, the rifle was manufactured prior to when they were working at the factory and apparently they engraved it outside of the factory. So, sort of, “factory engraving.” Sort of. And speaking of, “factory engraving” correct me if I’m wrong, but I thought I’ve read it wasn’t necessarily done in the factory? That is, some of it was contracted out? This rifle of course won’t letter as engraved. However, is it likely that some rifles that will letter as engraved, weren’t engraved actually at the factory?
Careful there, Steve. You’re beginning to sound like a lawyer. Any more of that inductive logic and I’m afraid you’ll disappear up your own fundamental aperture, to all our loss!
Surely, if Winchester took in a Custom Shop order that called for engraving, even though the shop contracted the engraving out to a distinguished master like Martin, the piece would letter because Cody gets the facts of the order from the Custom Shop work order and billing records in its possession. At least I thought they did…
What I don’t know and you may well, is, after Winchester closed the Custom Shop, would they still take custom orders and contract them out? Something about the Model 21 is jiggling my memory. At some point, didn’t they still take orders for a 21 but have Connecticut Shotgun Company make the gun and proof and mark it “Winchester” by permission?
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
And Lou, aren’t you on the Board? Perhaps you could suggest they consider asking Martin Rabeno to lecture to the Association at its Eastern show. I couldn’t attend but the membership would surely be attracted to such an event.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
Bill,
I am really enjoying this thread, thanks for getting it started!
Lou,
Thanks for the photos of your .270, it is nice to know that I am not the only geek that aligns the filler screw slots…..
Best Regards,
WACA Life Member #6284 - Specializing in Pre-64 Winchester .22 Rimfire
Guys i would believe that work that was commissioned directly from the custom shop would be factory engraved. When I log a gun into my books to engrave, I have to list who it is from and who returned to. If received from the custom shop, It was returned to the shop for finishing and assembly
As far as the model 21’s, according to Bruno the last 21’s were sold as a 3 gun set with a different engraver doing each one. I did one, Kurt Horvath did one and I do no recall who the third one was. Now mind you I am far from an expert on the custom shop. Pauline has a much better handle on all aspects as to what transpired over the years.
November 5, 2014
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Steve-
According to Pauline’s Winchester Engraving book, Nick Kusmit worked as a factory engraver from 1950-1981 and Jasper Salerno from 1968-1977. The most likely explanation (I suppose) that they collaborated on the Merz M1886 as an outside commission, but I suppose it’s possible that the rifle was sent to the factory to be upgraded. The distinction between “factory engraving” and “engraved by a factory engraver” is whether there was a factory work order, not whether the engraver took the piece home to work on… Like Martin said, if Winchester sent him a firearm to engrave and he returned it to the factory, then it’s factory engraving…
Good news is that Pauline has the factory engraver’s logs for all the in-house factory engravers from John Kusmit to herself… Among other things, these logs were the way the engravers got paid (recorded hours on a project), so one would imagine they would be complete/accurate with respect to factory authorized work. So if it important, Pauline could tell you whether the gun was done through the factory or not…
Zeb-
I am not on the WACA Board (nobody in their right mind would want ME!!!), but I think Vinny Martin puts the Eastern show together. So you could float the idea with him (assuming Martin would be up for it)…
JWA-
As much of a Geek as I am, I haven’t touched the screws on that 270 WCF. Must have been some other Geek!!! My Dad bought that rifle from Felix Bedlan back in the 1980s. It is pictured in the 2nd edition of Larry Wilson’s Winchester Engraving book where it’s attributed to John Kusmit, but since I don’t have a lot of faith in Larry Wilson, I asked Pauline’s opinion. She gave me a letter attributing the engraving to JK and also (at my request) stating that the stock carving was NOT done inside the factory (avoid future confusion). So I’m confident that it was an outside job…
Best,
Lou
WACA 9519; Studying Pre-64 Model 70 Winchesters
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