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Help from you Lyman peep sight experts.
January 12, 2020
9:37 pm
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I have a 1947 model 70 that came from the factory with a Lyman 48WJS peep sight on it. It was removed by a previous owner to install a scope. I want to put it back the way it came from Winchester. From what I can gather starting in 1947 Lyman came out with what is referred to as the third model 48WJS and that modification was the use of a shorter slide that only went to the number 60, earlier ones went to 75 or 125. This new sight change allowed the sight to be installed without the removal of wood from the rifle's stock. Now here's my question,,, I've noticed on some of these sights that are on model 70's and 52 sporters made in the 50's they have a white painted arrow and the word "up" on the top of the adjustment knob and on the windage knob, painted in white, is the letter "L" along with the arrow. So with all that being said were these Lyman 48WJS sights all painted from their introduction in 1947 or was there a time frame when Lyman started this painting practice? If I find a 48WJS and put it on the rifle that is painted will it be correct for a 1947 rifle? Anyone know the answer to these questions? If you can answer them, thanks in advance and I certainly appreciate it.  RRM

 

P.S.  any of you guys out there happen to have one you would consider selling? Thanks again.

January 12, 2020
10:47 pm
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Virginia
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Check out eBay.  There appears to be what you are looking for.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Lyman-48WJS-Receiver-Sight-used/254478847885?hash=item3b401f0f8d:g:clUAAOSwbTVeCAO-

Good luck.

Big Mac

January 12, 2020
10:53 pm
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Rat Rod Mac said
Anyone know the answer to these questions? If you can answer them, thanks in advance and I certainly appreciate it.  

Hold on till you hear from Louis.

January 12, 2020
11:04 pm
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Virginia
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I agree with Clarence, Louis Luttrell should be able to point in the correct direction.  In the meantime here is a link to previous forum discussion.

https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-sights/question-regarding-lyman-48wjs-sights/

Big Mac

January 12, 2020
11:48 pm
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Charleston, SC
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Jeez Guys... You give me WAY too much credit!!!!  I was going to respond to this to learn what y'all thought...

Hi RRM...

I dug through my parts cache to see if I could answer your question.  All the sights shown below have matching assembly numbers, so I assume they are correct.   Look closely at the photo:

Lyman-48-series-for-M70.jpegImage Enlarger

I THINK that this is the correct chronology for Lyman 48 sights relevant to cataloged M70 production (1936-1949).  It's true (as far as I can tell) that some real early M70s were made up with the Lyman 48W that was the usual receiver sight on the M54 when so-equipped. That one's not shown here b/c I no longer have a loose one - I gave away the only one I had - so would have to pull out a gun to take a pic of one.  But the photo roughly covers this topic from the outset of M70 production (I think)... Left to right...

The earliest Lyman 48 sights (roughly 1936-1937 or 38) were the 48WJ.  Is this correct nomenclature (???) - the relevant Lyman catalogs are not clear.  These were made with either the 150-point long slide or the cut-off 75 point slide.  They were "full block" sights that required the stock be notched. 

Next came the full block 48WJS (middle).  Note the knobs change from "thimble shaped" to the typical "target knobs" and that the slide is now "60-point", although I think some were made with target knobs and the 150-point or 75-point slides (which have a different thread on the elevation screw than the 60-point slides).  Collectively, this variant is the most often seen (I think???) on pre-war M70s with factory receiver sights (???).

In 1947 (FINALLY we come to your question!!!  Sorry!!! Wink) the sight changed to the "half-block" that did not require stock inletting (fourth from left).  IMHO this is the sight you need...

The last sight (right) shows a change that I think took place in the early 1950's, where the external leaf spring on the left side of the block was changed to an internal coil spring.  Since this was AFTER the Lyman 48WJS option was deleted from the catalog (last cataloged for standards and Supers in 1949), I personally assume that any M70 with the internal spring sight had it added by the owner.  

NOTE... There are NO white painted arrows on any of these sights.  I think that came later and as far as factory production goes is relevant ONLY to Lyman 48WH sights used on M70 Target rifles made before 1954.

Unfortunately the topic of correct M70 sights is a chapter unto itself....  Hope this helps...

Lou

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WACA 9519; Studying Pre-64 Model 70 Winchesters

WACA-Signauture-3.jpg

January 13, 2020
1:48 pm
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  I want to thank all of you for helping to clarify this sight situation for me. So it appears that I'm in search of a Lyman 48WJS with the target knobs and no white lettering. You guys come across a nice one for a fair price that you're not interested in send me a private message and I'll be sure to look into it. Once again, thank you.     RRM

January 13, 2020
3:48 pm
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Charleston, SC
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Hi RRM-

IMHO if you want to be EXACTLY correct, you need the 4th sight from the left in the photo above.  Half block, external leaf spring on the left side, target knobs.  I believe that this is the original version that did not require stock inletting as introduced in 1947. In fact, I think they made those early blocks from the full block bases by simply milling out the cove for stock clearance and relocating the D&T hole that held the spring tension screw in place.

The internal coil springs (sight on right), "Stayset" knobs (the round top hunter knobs), and white lines were later developments arising in the early 1950's or thereabouts.  Too late to have been factory supplied on a M70 in 1947.

I do not have an extra one of the sight you need (beyond the one I took a photo of last night), but I'll let you know if I see one as I search for them daily.  In fact, for well over a year I've been looking (to no avail) for a full block Lyman 48WH with 75-point slide for a pre-war M70 target rifle in 257 ROBERTS.  So if anybody out there sees or has one of those for sale, please let ME know!!! Laugh 

These danged sights can be pricey, but first you have to find them!!!

Lou

WACA 9519; Studying Pre-64 Model 70 Winchesters

WACA-Signauture-3.jpg

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