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Winchester 1895 35 WCF and Winchester 1873 32 WCF
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Stuarts Draft, VA
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January 3, 2023 - 3:30 pm
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retrievePhoto-5.jpgImage EnlargerretrievePhoto-6.jpgImage EnlargerretrievePhoto-11.jpgImage EnlargerretrievePhoto-12.jpgImage EnlargerretrievePhoto-13.jpgImage EnlargerFound this Winchester 1895 35 WCF and a Winchester 1873 32 WCF for sale in this online auction in Virginia. Do they look like decent investments? 

 

https://bid.enlistedauctions.com/ui/auctions/93042?query=winchester

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January 3, 2023 - 4:20 pm
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The 73 is not a investment or collector grade gun. its got missing and replaced parts. The mag tube is bent. It might be a shooter grade gun if it feeds and fires accurately.

Bob

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73_86cutaway.jpg

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January 3, 2023 - 4:41 pm
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The 1895 might be worth owning as a gun to use or as a lower end collector but it’s condition doesn’t make it a great collector piece

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January 3, 2023 - 5:08 pm
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1873man said
The 73 is not a investment or collector grade gun. its got missing and replaced parts. The mag tube is bent. It might be a shooter grade gun if it feeds and fires accurately.

Bob

  

Where do you see the bent mag tube? I’m just learning about these guns. 

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January 3, 2023 - 5:27 pm
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WACA Life Member---
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Cody Firearms member since 1991
Researching the Winchester 1873's

73_86cutaway.jpg

Email: [email protected]

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January 3, 2023 - 5:42 pm
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1873man said
198668637_1800x1135_1000000000_CENTER_FFFFFF.JPGImage Enlarger198668797_1800x1135_1000000000_CENTER_FFFFFF.JPGImage Enlarger

  

Thanks! 

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January 3, 2023 - 5:46 pm
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sb said
The 1895 might be worth owning as a gun to use or as a lower end collector but it’s condition doesn’t make it a great collector piece

  

The word “investment” generally means there is a guarantee or at least a good chance of some return/appreciation on what you spent to buy it. For old Winchesters, the best chance of this happening has historically been the best with brass, case hardening and checkering with condition being paramount. However, first and foremost, the gun must be original and correct or there is a high chance you will not get much if any appreciation. The sling swivels on the Model 95 are not original and the gun had to be altered to add them. Condition aside, this has ruined the collector/investment value of the old gun for me – not saying it won’t be worth more money in a few years if you buy it cheap enough. The Model 95 Winchester is a great gun and the .35 WCF is getting hard to find – there has recently been some discussion here on the Forum regarding the model and caliber. The old gun still retains value as a shooter/hunter so if you buy it do so because you like it not as an investment. Just my humble opinion being fully aware many do not and have never agreed with my collecting opinions.

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January 3, 2023 - 6:52 pm
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Burt Humphrey said

sb said

The 1895 might be worth owning as a gun to use or as a lower end collector but it’s condition doesn’t make it a great collector piece

  

The word “investment” generally means there is a guarantee or at least a good chance of some return/appreciation on what you spent to buy it. For old Winchesters, the best chance of this happening has historically been the best with brass, case hardening and checkering with condition being paramount. However, first and foremost, the gun must be original and correct or there is a high chance you will not get much if any appreciation. The sling swivels on the Model 95 are not original and the gun had to be altered to add them. Condition aside, this has ruined the collector/investment value of the old gun for me – not saying it won’t be worth more money in a few years if you buy it cheap enough. The Model 95 Winchester is a great gun and the .35 WCF is getting hard to find – there has recently been some discussion here on the Forum regarding the model and caliber. The old gun still retains value as a shooter/hunter so if you buy it do so because you like it not as an investment. Just my humble opinion being fully aware many do not and have never agreed with my collecting opinions.

  

I am hoping that Bert, Clarence or other knowledgeable WACA member will chime in on the swivels. I had always thought on the Model 95, front swivel studs were dovetailed into the barrel but on page 469 of the Madis Book (blue one) he notes that ocassionally studs were affixed to the fore-end. The Model 95 they are shown on is also a standard grade in caliber 35 WCF.

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January 3, 2023 - 7:16 pm
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Burt Humphrey said I am hoping that Bert, Clarence or other knowledgeable WACA member will chime in on the swivels.

If it had the traditional hook swivels, I’d say “well done,” & let’s add $200 to the value, original or not.  Question is, when was this style discontinued?  Still listed in ’34.  Looks of ones on this gun not appealing to me, but they demonstrate previous owner knew something about gun handling.

I have a HW with the front stud attached to the brl. & like the looks of it better than a forearm attachment, though it deprives you of being able to use a hasty sling to shoot.

Useful caliber or not, I think .35 WCF is a detriment, not an asset.

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January 3, 2023 - 7:31 pm
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Burt Humphrey said

sb said

The 1895 might be worth owning as a gun to use or as a lower end collector but it’s condition doesn’t make it a great collector piece

  

The word “investment” generally means there is a guarantee or at least a good chance of some return/appreciation on what you spent to buy it. For old Winchesters, the best chance of this happening has historically been the best with brass, case hardening and checkering with condition being paramount. However, first and foremost, the gun must be original and correct or there is a high chance you will not get much if any appreciation. The sling swivels on the Model 95 are not original and the gun had to be altered to add them. Condition aside, this has ruined the collector/investment value of the old gun for me – not saying it won’t be worth more money in a few years if you buy it cheap enough. The Model 95 Winchester is a great gun and the .35 WCF is getting hard to find – there has recently been some discussion here on the Forum regarding the model and caliber. The old gun still retains value as a shooter/hunter so if you buy it do so because you like it not as an investment. Just my humble opinion being fully aware many do not and have never agreed with my collecting opinions.

  

Thank you for the information. Very helpful

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January 3, 2023 - 11:43 pm
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Sheldon you have learned that one key element of collecting is to ask. You have found a place that has some , if not most of the brightest Winchester minds out there. Lord knows they give me an education almost daily! 

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January 4, 2023 - 2:46 am
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I am reminded of a firmly tongue in cheek article in some periodical many years ago.  Fellow wrote of inheriting a London Best quality, hand made side by side shotgun.  A year later he had traded it for a Remington Model 870 that worked correctly most of the time, a used reloading press, some spare shotgun components, and a few hundred dollars.  No longer sure of the exact details, but it was a twisted story of how his trading expertise failed miserably.  There are those who also can fall into a cesspit and come out smelling like a rose after finding a pot of gold in the bottom.  Not me, nor most “COLLECTORS”.  Burt has it right.  And I would not be at all interested in the 1895 either.  But if you LIKE it as it is and don’t plan to make it turn over into a fortune, then the choice is yours and yours alone.  My early “starters” generally at best held their value.  One or two I lost money on when I was able to upgrade.  IF you are wanting to invest, careful selection of the very highest grades will do passable, but often investments in the stocks or bonds will outperform over time.  Just not this year!

My take, and mine alone.  TimCry

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January 4, 2023 - 6:36 am
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tim tomlinson said
 IF you are wanting to invest, careful selection of the very highest grades will do passable, but often investments in the stocks or bonds will outperform over time.  Just not this year!

My take, and mine alone.  TimCry

  

The one thing that is hard to place a value on is the pure enjoyment of owning an old Winchester. I collected them for over 50 years. I did not have a huge collection like a lot of guys and I did not have as many high end and expensive guns as do a lot of collectors. But, I tried to only buy and keep guns that were original and correct. When I decided to quit collecting I had about 65 Winchester’s, including every lever action model. I am now down to 8 guns, one of each model made in the 19th century. I will keep these and see how well I age. I am lucky and did not sell because I needed money, I sold them because I did not want to leave my wife a big mess. I am content with having been a diligent caretaker and have passed them to others for them to enjoy. I have always been a student and fan of condition. David Bichrest used to have business cards with the slogan “Where Condition Is Everything”. This is absolutely true as long as the gun is right – if a gun has been messed with it will probably come back to bite you. As Tim noted above, I also believe that high end guns will appreciate more than lesser condition guns but 80% Winchesters, if original and correct, should appreciate and will always be marketable because the guns which are right are being tucked away at a rapid pace – Winchesters are like land, they are not making any more of them (except the fakers and their re-done parts guns). When I first met my old friend Tommy Rholes at a Vegas gun show in the early 80’s he told me to buy the best I could afford and make quality over quantity my objective. He put it this way, “if you have $10,000 to spend buy the best gun you can find for $10,000, don’t buy ten $1,000 guns. Lots of guys don’t agree with that philosophy and that is ok – everyone should buy what they like and what they can afford. Since coming to Alaska almost 50 years ago I have endured a lot of long and cold winter nights. So many of these nights, over many years, were spent reading Shotgun News, CADA Gun Journal and dealer gun lists while planning my next gun show. Collecting old Winchesters was a totally different endeavor before computers and the internet and when auctions were not that plentiful. This was one of my hobbies and I thoroughly enjoyed it. It is hard to place a value on it. Would I have been better off with more of my money in Mutual Funds? I have never tried to run the numbers but when you look at how long I had a lot of the guns they may not have been as good of an investment as other options but I did have appreciation. How much enjoyment did I get out of Mutual Funds – can’t say I got any enjoyment other than making a little money but collecting the old Winchester levers brought me considerable enjoyment and many friendships – hard to place a monetary value on that!

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January 4, 2023 - 1:17 pm
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Burt Humphrey said

tim tomlinson said

 IF you are wanting to invest, careful selection of the very highest grades will do passable, but often investments in the stocks or bonds will outperform over time.  Just not this year!

My take, and mine alone.  TimCry

  

The one thing that is hard to place a value on is the pure enjoyment of owning an old Winchester. I collected them for over 50 years. I did not have a huge collection like a lot of guys and I did not have as many high end and expensive guns as do a lot of collectors. But, I tried to only buy and keep guns that were original and correct. When I decided to quit collecting I had about 65 Winchester’s, including every lever action model. I am now down to 8 guns, one of each model made in the 19th century. I will keep these and see how well I age. I am lucky and did not sell because I needed money, I sold them because I did not want to leave my wife a big mess. I am content with having been a diligent caretaker and have passed them to others for them to enjoy. I have always been a student and fan of condition. David Bichrest used to have business cards with the slogan “Where Condition Is Everything”. This is absolutely true as long as the gun is right – if a gun has been messed with it will probably come back to bite you. As Tim noted above, I also believe that high end guns will appreciate more than lesser condition guns but 80% Winchesters, if original and correct, should appreciate and will always be marketable because the guns which are right are being tucked away at a rapid pace – Winchesters are like land, they are not making any more of them (except the fakers and their re-done parts guns). When I first met my old friend Tommy Rholes at a Vegas gun show in the early 80’s he told me to buy the best I could afford and make quality over quantity my objective. He put it this way, “if you have $10,000 to spend buy the best gun you can find for $10,000, don’t buy ten $1,000 guns. Lots of guys don’t agree with that philosophy and that is ok – everyone should buy what they like and what they can afford. Since coming to Alaska almost 50 years ago I have endured a lot of long and cold winter nights. So many of these nights, over many years, were spent reading Shotgun News, CADA Gun Journal and dealer gun lists while planning my next gun show. Collecting old Winchesters was a totally different endeavor before computers and the internet and when auctions were not that plentiful. This was one of my hobbies and I thoroughly enjoyed it. It is hard to place a value on it. Would I have been better off with more of my money in Mutual Funds? I have never tried to run the numbers but when you look at how long I had a lot of the guns they may not have been as good of an investment as other options but I did have appreciation. How much enjoyment did I get out of Mutual Funds – can’t say I got any enjoyment other than making a little money but collecting the old Winchester levers brought me considerable enjoyment and many friendships – hard to place a monetary value on that!

73del7-1.jpgImage Enlarger

  

I’m sure I could learn a lot from you! Love the picture. The rifle and the Remington statue go well together. 

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January 4, 2023 - 6:01 pm
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Burt Humphrey said
David Bichrest used to have business cards with the slogan “Where Condition Is Everything”.

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I still have one of those cards.  It was long ago when he lived in Maine.

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January 4, 2023 - 8:21 pm
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Burt Humphrey said

  When I first met my old friend Tommy Rholes at a Vegas gun show in the early 80’s he told me to buy the best I could afford and make quality over quantity my objective. He put it this way, “if you have $10,000 to spend buy the best gun you can find for $10,000, don’t buy ten $1,000 guns. Lots of guys don’t agree with that philosophy and that is ok – everyone should buy what they like and what they can afford.

Well, that’s right, if your principal objective is return on investment, but mine is learning as much about as many different guns as I can; I’m a gun-lover, not an investor.  A lot can be learned from books, but there’s no substitute for hands-on experience.  So, not that I’d have had the 10 Gs anyway, but (speaking theoretically), I’d have bought the 10 “cheap” guns, shot them, then probably after a while traded them for something different. 

What a blessing it was to grow up in the Golden Age of cheap foreign milsurp imports, the ’60s & ’70s!  Mausers of all different periods, Arisakas, Martinis, Snyders, Enfields, Krags, etc.  Many couldn’t be shot for lack of ammo, but at least you could learn how the actions worked & judge their quality. 

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January 4, 2023 - 9:37 pm
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clarence said

Burt Humphrey said

  When I first met my old friend Tommy Rholes at a Vegas gun show in the early 80’s he told me to buy the best I could afford and make quality over quantity my objective. He put it this way, “if you have $10,000 to spend buy the best gun you can find for $10,000, don’t buy ten $1,000 guns. Lots of guys don’t agree with that philosophy and that is ok – everyone should buy what they like and what they can afford.

Well, that’s right, if your principal objective is return on investment, but mine is learning as much about as many different guns as I can; I’m a gun-lover, not an investor.  A lot can be learned from books, but there’s no substitute for hands-on experience.  So, not that I’d have had the 10 Gs anyway, but (speaking theoretically), I’d have bought the 10 “cheap” guns, shot them, then probably after a while traded them for something different. 

What a blessing it was to grow up in the Golden Age of cheap foreign milsurp imports, the ’60s & ’70s!  Mausers of all different periods, Arisakas, Martinis, Snyders, Enfields, Krags, etc.  Many couldn’t be shot for lack of ammo, but at least you could learn how the actions worked & judge their quality. 

  

Clarence – I can honestly say that I never purchased a Winchester with re-sale in mind and I never purchased a Winchester as an investment. I bought the guns because I had been in awe of them since I was a little boy and the fascination never subsided. When my dad gave me a 94 in 30-30 at the age of 12 the Winchesters became a passion that has lasted 60 years. I was buying them in high school. It would be hard to find someone that loves the old levers more than me. But, there are lots of collectors that know a lot more about them than I do and that is what brought me to WACA and this Forum a long time ago. I know a lot of gun collectors/nuts that prefer quantity to quality and variety makes the world go around. But, I was always drawn to the high conditon and rare guns. Of my remaining Winchesters I have had all of them between 30 and 40 years and many I sold I had owned for longer than that. I bought them because I liked them and kept them for the same reason. It is only age that has changed my direction.

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January 4, 2023 - 10:47 pm
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Burt Humphrey said Clarence – I can honestly say that I never purchased a Winchester with re-sale in mind and I never purchased a Winchester as an investment.
  

Neither have I, Burt, but I wasn’t referring to your guns, but to Tommy Rholes’ advice on collecting; I knew him too, though can’t remember buying anything from him, as I was more interested in other kinds of guns. 

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January 5, 2023 - 12:44 am
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Burt Humphrey said

clarence said

Burt Humphrey said

 But, there are lots of collectors that know a lot more about them than I do and that is what brought me to WACA and this Forum a long time ago.

Burt,

I wouldn’t exactly knock your knowledge base.  You are amongst the most knowledgeable individuals on this forum.  If not in the top 2 or 3, definitely within the top 5.

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January 5, 2023 - 2:22 am
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Chuck said

Burt Humphrey said

David Bichrest used to have business cards with the slogan “Where Condition Is Everything”.

73del7-1.jpgImage Enlarger

  

I still have one of those cards.  It was long ago when he lived in Maine.

  

Chuck – I have not seen David in many years – he lives in Texas now. He used to come to Alaska to hunt Dall Sheep and has been to my home and fondled Winchesters a couple of times. Over the years, some of the finest Winchester’s have been thru his hands. Over 40 years ago I bought this Model 65 from him – it is a 218 Bee and between the rarity of the model, originality, configuration, caliber, and condition it is a gun the likes of which very few will be fortunate enough to own.

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