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March 9, 2013
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Could anyone tell me what year Winchester started putting ramp style front sights on their light-weight rifle barrels?
July 7, 2011
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GPD328
Go back and look at this post. I would like to narrow down that very same question.
http://www.winchestercollector.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5997
This is my ELW from 10-26-1907 ( bottom rifle )
http://s1224.photobucket.com/user/oldguy67/media/373316/19_zpse3fec927.jpg.html
[Image Can Not Be Found]
Paul
March 9, 2013
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Thanks 94shortie.
The reason I asked is I have a LTW button mag rifle 30 W.C.F., Ser#61,xxx, only number stamped underneath the barrel is a, 5. My Rifle has a ramped front sight and the muzzle measures +/-0.544". All the barrel markings match for the serial number range. In the other post they talked about the front sight ramps not coming until later in production. I was curious as to what others might know about this.
July 7, 2011
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GPD328
With a s/n of 61XXX, that would be an 1899 DOM rifle. That would be a real early gun for a ramp front sight but, that is what keeps us looking for answers. Have you done a s/n search on this rifle? If so, what info did you get from Cody? Some photos would be nice also.
Paul
March 9, 2013
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Paul,
I did not send for a Cody Facts Sheet on this particular rifle. The serial# 61212. I am not a member of the Cody Museum and any information that could be found would be appreciated. I will attempt to post some pics but I am not the best at posting them and will get some help soon.
Thanks, Nick
July 7, 2011
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Here are some photos of an ELW rifle from 1899 with a ramp front sight for GPD328.
http://s1224.photobucket.com/user/oldguy67/media/1894%20others/61212%20ramp%20sight/f82dd3a3-6be6-47f8-9e63-a4636fb798eb_zps763ee9d3.jpg.html
[Image Can Not Be Found]
http://s1224.photobucket.com/user/oldguy67/media/1894%20others/61212%20ramp%20sight/2176244c-7915-4053-80fd-1f31bfb86bda_zps434e9316.jpg.html
[Image Can Not Be Found]
http://s1224.photobucket.com/user/oldguy67/media/1894%20others/61212%20ramp%20sight/4a027f32-c31e-4881-903a-58570c172553_zps39453e2a.jpg.html
[Image Can Not Be Found]
http://s1224.photobucket.com/user/oldguy67/media/1894%20others/61212%20ramp%20sight/4_zps107d366e.jpg.html
[Image Can Not Be Found]
It looks like the change from dovetail front sights to ramp front sights was another case where there was an overlap on the ELW rifles. 😕
Paul
April 30, 2006
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Rather than overlap, ramp sights started to be installed on all ELW rifles especially (and earlier) on the larger calibers when problems arose. It should be quite apparent why!
July 8, 2012
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Since this post is about model 1894 light weight barrels, take a look at this one at Cabelas. It doesn’t have the ramp style front sight. Sure looks like a nice rifle. Does the 26" tapered octogon barrel make it any more rare than a round barrel?
July 7, 2011
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Some members on the forum have rapid taper octagon barreled rifles and they have posted photos of them in the past. Leroy Merz had some of both round and octagon but I am just guessing that the octagon barrels are not as common as the round ones.
fyi
The s/n was applied to the above rifle on 10-25-1897
March 1, 2009
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Tionesta,
It,s a nice rifle but that nasty scratch on the left side of the receiver and the steel wool marks on the right side of the receiver would deter me from shelling out 15k.
John K.
July 8, 2012
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Thanks 94Shorties. John, i agree about the scratch and steel wool marks, $15k is a lot of money to pay especially if it has those marks. Believe me, I’m relatively new to this and $15k is not something I’d pay without a lot of thought and input from you experts.
Thanks,
Al
May 24, 2012
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I don’t care for the scratches either, nor the variance in the grade/figure of wood on the stocks.
April 15, 2005
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Just an observation… thus far, all of the octagon barreled Model 1894 ELW rifles I have seen have a dovetail for the front sight, and conversely, the vast majority of the round barrels or 1/2 octagon barrels have a ramp. Do any of you own or can confirm an octagon barrel with a ramp?
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
July 7, 2011
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Here are 2 round barreled ELW rifles from a previous post that have the dovetail front sight, plus an octagon ELW with the dovetail. Since I usually just look for short rifles, I have not paid that much attension to the ELW’s but, maybe now I will.
http://www.winchestercollector.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5997
Paul
February 27, 2005
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Bert,
That’s the pattern I have noticed. While there likely are exceptions, it appears the octagon barrels were mostly dovetailed and the round barrels mostly had ramps.
In addition to the 26 inch full octagon extra light I posted a picture of in the other thread, I have another extra light, 20 inch, full octagon barreled short rifle with a dovetail that I will try to get pictures up soon.
Rapid taper, standard taper, extra heavy. All 45 caliber.
February 27, 2005
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Here is the extra light, 20" full octagon short rifle. Notice front sight dovetail in barrel.
While too late to letter, the rifle has matching assembly numbers on the lower tang and upper tang inlet.
In addition, on the receiver end of the 8 3/8" forend, the wood is stamped: EX. LT. SPECIAL.
http://s26.photobucket.com/user/3855/media/IMG_1626_zps3a773558.jpg.html
[Image Can Not Be Found]
http://s26.photobucket.com/user/3855/media/e299fd7d-795d-4298-9995-6c1988e41013_zps8d826f37.jpg.html
[Image Can Not Be Found]
Rapid taper, standard taper, extra heavy. All 45 caliber.
July 7, 2011
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3855
That is a real nice short rifle you have there with several special order features. Would you be willing to send me the s/n, even if it is just the first 3 digits, and the caliber to add to my short rifle survey? You can send it by PM or email if you would.
Paul
November 17, 2011
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When we see a rifle that is like the octagon 20" Extra Lightweight pictured above, how do we know it was not a 22" that was shortened, factory new or rework or otherwise? Seems to me with the regard to the barrel length it is just the factory level of workmanship on the sight and muzzle that is the proof?
January 24, 2013
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CJ
Bottom line is that you dont. If the work was done correctly, there is no real way to tell.
V/R
Mike
May 23, 2009
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Mike is absolutely correct.
Unless someone happens to stumble across the million missing factory ledger entries. And I doubt that is going to happen.
Sincerely,
Maverick
WACA #8783 - Checkout my Reloading Tool Survey!
https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-research-surveys/winchester-reloading-tool-survey/
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