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July 27, 2020
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I have an 1873 2nd model deluxe rifle with 24″ octagon barrel, pistol grip with fancy checkered walnut stock, in unmarked 44-40 caliber.
The serial number is not found on the lower tang as usual but has unusual numbers between the lever lock and last stock screw. 74 16 appears but I’ve never seen markings like this on a 73.
Inside the buttstock are 3 numbers xxS674 which match the lever tang numbers.
Any help on the serial number and dating it would be greatly appreciated.
July 31, 2005
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Madis mentions on page 132 of my copy of The Winchester Book that some 1873 rifles will be without a serial number on the lower tang. If there were problems with the trigger whether it was plain or set, Winchester replaced the entire lower tang. These lower tangs were not numbered.
That may be a possibility here.
Gordon’s Winchester’s New Model of 1873 – A Tribute Volume 1 has some information on assembly numbers on page 335. Not sure what the other numbers mean.
I call myself a collector as it sounds better than hoarder
July 27, 2020
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My understanding is the internal serial numbers would be the last few of the firearm SN which seems to be the case but I cannot locate anywhere else the SN could be or would be. That would be a thought to have had the tang replaced. The rifle is in excellent condition with a lot of color case hardening still visible. The area on the tang where I expected it to be appears to be the same condition as the rest of the receiver and is free and clear of any marks or damage.
I’ll check the Madis book in my dad’s library. Thanks!
I would upload photos but am still having difficulty figuring how to do it.
April 15, 2005
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Primmdog73 said
I would upload photos but am still having difficulty figuring how to do it.
Here are the instructions – https://winchestercollector.org/forum/forum-rules-and-faqs/posting-photos-is-easier-than-ever/
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
July 27, 2020
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I saw that Bert, and tried twice, both times with error messages. I’ll try again.
[Image Can Not Be Found]
Also when trying to upload one (1.4 M) or four, the files drop down to and error 108-Could not create user folder message. I think I’m making this harder than it should be. Pictures speak volumes, clear detailed pictures are even better.
Scott
May 2, 2009
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It sounds like you have assemble numbers on the side of the lower tang but no serial number on the bottom. Picture will be very helpful for this. If you can’t post them, email them to me and the address below my picture.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
July 27, 2020
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Thanks Bob, email is on its way with pictures. Let me know if you need more than I sent. 
Scott
May 2, 2009
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Scott,
What you have is the lower tang was broken or swapped at the lever latch. The serial number is 74×16 were the center digit is filed off in the process of welding and is not readable.
The number on the wood and lever are assemble numbers and have nothing to do with the serial number. The S is for shotgun butt and the XX is the grade of the wood. Look on the insides of the side plates for numbers. Those can be the last digits of the serial number.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
July 27, 2020
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Bob, much appreciated for the information. You were spot on correct. I took the stock off again to inspect the tang and it has obviously been repaired as seen and felt by the weld. The side plates have the same two last digits as on the lower tang SN but unknown what the center numbers are since they are obviously filed off during the weld. Not sure if I will ever be able to tell what it was.
Thanks again for your experience and expert knowledge. l
Scott
May 2, 2009
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Scott,
There are a couple ways to get the serial number. First one is the cheapest is to have Cody check the records for 74016, 74116, 74216 etc. until you get to 74916. If your lucky there is just one match. You don’t have to do 74616 since I have it in my survey and its a plain 38 caliber. The other way is to have a good gunsmith that know how to work on old Winchester lift the serial number with acid and properly repair the tang and restamp the number in the correct font. Or they can lift the serial number and leave as is. When You lift a number they will have to polish the area to get a good lift and don’t try stamping the number on the tang as it is now since it will most certainly break off again.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
July 27, 2020
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Very good information to know. I’ll call Cody and see what information they have on this. Thank you!
Scott
May 2, 2009
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Here are the side plate photos.
Also I see the lever stamped with a assembly number which makes me think the side of the elevator might be as well.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
May 2, 2009
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Also another place to look is on the side of the butt plate screws. It just might be engraved guns that I have seen that one done but its worth a look and while you got those off there should be a number on the butt plate near the toe.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
July 27, 2020
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1873man said
Here are the side plate photos.Also I see the lever stamped with a assembly number which makes me think the side of the elevator might be as well.
Bob
1873man said
Also another place to look is on the side of the butt plate screws. It just might be engraved guns that I have seen that one done but its worth a look and while you got those off there should be a number on the butt plate near the toe.Bob
I did not find an assembly number on the elevator nor on the butt plate. I also checked the screws on this one and on my Ulrich engraved 66. Neither has numbers on the butt stock screws. The 66 does have assembly numbers on the butt plate however.
July 27, 2020
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1873man said
Scott,There are a couple ways to get the serial number. First one is the cheapest is to have Cody check the records for 74016, 74116, 74216 etc. until you get to 74916. If your lucky there is just one match. You don’t have to do 74616 since I have it in my survey and its a plain 38 caliber. The other way is to have a good gunsmith that know how to work on old Winchester lift the serial number with acid and properly repair the tang and restamp the number in the correct font. Or they can lift the serial number and leave as is. When You lift a number they will have to polish the area to get a good lift and don’t try stamping the number on the tang as it is now since it will most certainly break off again.
Bob
Cody Research looked at 10 pages of records and came up with the closest match. If the 73 standard rifle barrel is 24″ then I have a match with SN 74216. Records show this is a standard length octagon rifle barrel, fancy stock with pistol grip, checkering and a shotgun stock and smooth trigger in 44-40.
The only other that was close is a 30″ round barrel. None of the 10 in this search range showed and firearm being returned for any work at the factory.
Scott
May 2, 2009
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Scott,
You can have them make you a letter for the gun and have them note the search of the records they did to lock that serial number to the gun. They my not do it on the same letter but as long as its on their letter head it will help the guns value.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
March 31, 2020
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1873man said
Scott,There are a couple ways to get the serial number. First one is the cheapest is to have Cody check the records for 74016, 74116, 74216 etc. until you get to 74916. If your lucky there is just one match. You don’t have to do 74616 since I have it in my survey and its a plain 38 caliber. The other way is to have a good gunsmith that know how to work on old Winchester lift the serial number with acid and properly repair the tang and restamp the number in the correct font. Or they can lift the serial number and leave as is. When You lift a number they will have to polish the area to get a good lift and don’t try stamping the number on the tang as it is now since it will most certainly break off again.
Bob
Regarding the lifting of serial numbers:
Some time back I acquired a 1894 with no sign of any serial number at the usual location (lower receiver in front of the forend). Midas mentioned that Sears & Robuck purchased a number of 94’s and promptly removed the serial numbers for one reason or another. If mine was one of those rifles they sure did a beautiful job because there is no indication that there had been any buffing, grinding or filing of any sort in that area.
Assuming there had been a serial number there at some point I did some research and found that from a forensic standpoint there was a process employed that could make the “lost” serial number discernable. It required the use of a chemical called Fry’s Reagent. After receiving a small bottle in the mail I followed the directions which involved making a clay dam around the area where the number should be. That done, I applied about 10 drops of the reagent and waited. About 20-30 minutes later………there it was, plain as day.
May 2, 2009
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Tyke,
When I lift a number I don’t do the dam, just dab it with a Q-tip to keep it wet and at most 5 minutes.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
April 15, 2005
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Tyke said
Regarding the lifting of serial numbers:
Some time back I acquired a 1894 with no sign of any serial number at the usual location (lower receiver in front of the forend). Midas mentioned that Sears & Robuck purchased a number of 94’s and promptly removed the serial numbers for one reason or another. If mine was one of those rifles they sure did a beautiful job because there is no indication that there had been any buffing, grinding or filing of any sort in that area.
Assuming there had been a serial number there at some point I did some research and found that from a forensic standpoint there was a process employed that could make the “lost” serial number discernable. It required the use of a chemical called Fry’s Reagent. After receiving a small bottle in the mail I followed the directions which involved making a clay dam around the area where the number should be. That done, I applied about 10 drops of the reagent and waited. About 20-30 minutes later………there it was, plain as day.
As a point of interest, the Winchester firearms that Sears & Roebuck intentionally altered have “WRACO” stamped over the top of the original serial number. They first stamped a cross-hatch pattern, then stamped the WRACO marking. This is found on several models, all of which were manufactured in the mid to late 1890s.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
March 15, 2020
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About 60 years ago a guy tried to sell me an 1873 winchester with no serial no. He thought it was some sort of a transitional gun. I didn’t buy it as it was way up to about $50. Were there other guns known to be without serial nos. or was it messed with? Don
