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18" short rifle Model 94
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August 2, 2013 - 3:29 am
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The most likely way it came to be is that it was born with a 22" barrel and was later returned to the factory for a barrel cut down to 20". Possibly to repair damage or a bulge near the muzzle. It does not look like a modern faked gun. Notice the blue in the tube hanger dovetail and matching wear. Still a gun like that suffers in value because there will always be doubt.

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August 2, 2013 - 3:48 am
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After taking out a 20" short rifle and then measuring back, I now agree with Bert. You could cut 1" off the barrel and not have to recut the dovetail for the hanger and that would place the takedown lever just where it looks like in the photos. He measured the barrel from the front of the receiver to the muzzle and got 18". Now add the 1" for the takedown ring and receiver and you get a 19" barrel. Last night I was thinking a 20" rifle would not give enough room until I took one out this morning and actually did the measurements.

Paul

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August 2, 2013 - 3:53 am
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That would make perfect sense to me. Thanks!

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August 2, 2013 - 5:50 am
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Like you said Paul, if the bbl is 18" from muzzle to receiver plus 1" for takedown ring and bbl thread spacing it has to currently be 19". I would think the same that it had 1" cut off an original 20" barrel. However, if it were cut at 1" wouldn’t we be seeing some trace of the old front sight dovetail at the muzzle? The magazine tube retaining band milling is right and is original–the inlet in the bbl for the takedown lever looks pretty close to the right milling as well. Given the barrel length at 19" the mag tube dovetail measurement would be in excess of 3 3/8" had it been a 22" barrel to begin with. Would like to see the front sight dovetail milling and have a precise measurement of the bbl at the muzzle to take this a step further.

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1892takedown @sbcglobal.net ......NRA Endowment Life Member.....WACA Member

"God is great.....beer is good.....and people are crazy"... Billy Currington

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August 2, 2013 - 6:10 am
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I would get an exact measurement of the barrel length. If it was originally a 20-inch, it should be about 1/4" shy of 19 inches now.

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August 2, 2013 - 6:10 am
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I had the same thought about the front sight dovetail that it would be very close but I think it would just clear, even if they took off just a little more than 1". If it was a 22" that was cut back, they would need to recut the mag band dovetail. If the factory did it, why not put the dovetail cut in the normal spacing. With a 20" barrel, only the front sight dovetail would need to be redone and save extra work even if it was factory done. The TD assembly is 2" long and would just clear on a 20" cut barrel.
Just my thoughts on it.

Paul

If it was a 22" and they cut off 3", the original dovetail for the mag band would still be there and show.

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August 2, 2013 - 7:17 am
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The two separate spin marks on the mag tube are saying something as well.

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August 2, 2013 - 8:58 am
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Bert H. said
If it was shortened, I believe that the original barrel length was 20-inches.

I wondered about that too because it looked like about 1 inch was removed, but the OP’s initial statement that the barrel was 18 inches combined with those two sets of marks on the magazine was very puzzling. The new information on how the barrel was measured appears to confirm your assessment, but those two sets of marks on the magazine are still a mystery, to me anyway.

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August 2, 2013 - 9:37 am
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Here are a couple shots of the dovetail. The barrel measures exactly 19" from the muzzle to the end of the breech. I would say 94shorties explanation is the most logical. What does everyone think?

http://s155.photobucket.com/user/theresasink/media/94%20Winchester/dovetail001_zps283d8037.jpg.html

[Image Can Not Be Found]

http://s155.photobucket.com/user/theresasink/media/94%20Winchester/dovetail002_zps540ac297.jpg.html

[Image Can Not Be Found]

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August 2, 2013 - 10:22 am
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lexington1
Being an impartial judge, I think we have got it. Laugh
I was just about to post some closeups so you could see where to take the different measurements from but no need to do it now. Enjoy your family owned Winchester.

Paul

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August 2, 2013 - 10:46 am
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Thanks Paul!

Wes

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August 2, 2013 - 10:50 am
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Just out of curiosity, how common would this gun be with the 20" barrel?

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August 2, 2013 - 1:48 pm
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Wes
Out of all the short rifles I have kept a log of, only 1 was a 20" PG-CK rifle. In that same set of data, I have 11 22" PG-CK rifles. Based on what I have seen, the 20" like yours would be very uncommon. Maybe others have come across more of them before.

Paul

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August 11, 2013 - 6:06 pm
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OMG – here we go again – that Ezikial!!!! My bet that it’s actually a 19" takedown with folks taking measurements from different places. There are two of them in my book on page 26.

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August 12, 2013 - 4:28 am
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BOBR94 said
OMG – here we go again – that Ezikial!!!! My bet that it’s actually a 19" takedown with folks taking measurements from different places. There are two of them in my book on page 26.

The 2 shown on page 26 have the mag retaining band in the right place and the takedown lever is about 1 inch from the band. The rifle in question has the takedown lever almost touching the mag band. He stated that he took the barrel measurement from the edge of the receiver and got the 18". IMHO, I still think it was a 20" barrel that was cut back.
There is an 18" OB, FM, TD and a 19" OB, FM, TD on page 104 of BOBR94’s book and again, the mag band is in the right place and look at the takedown levers position in relation to the mag band.

Paul

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August 12, 2013 - 4:59 am
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I guess everyone has their own thoughts and ways of doing things right
or wrong. IMHO the first thing that comes to mind would be to find out
the true length of the barrel? The owner says from the receiver? and this
is a takedown. Someone please correct me if I am wrong but when I
measure the length of a barrel I insert a wooden dowel or cleaning rod into
the muzzle end of the barrel and with the bolt closed and the rod resting
on the face of the bolt mark the rod at the end of the muzzle and measure
the distance between the two marks?????? PS MAKE SURE THE GUN
IS UNLOADED !!!!!!!!!!!

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August 12, 2013 - 12:05 pm
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quantrez said
I guess everyone has their own thoughts and ways of doing things right
or wrong. IMHO the first thing that comes to mind would be to find out
the true length of the barrel? The owner says from the receiver? and this
is a takedown. Someone please correct me if I am wrong but when I
measure the length of a barrel I insert a wooden dowel or cleaning rod into
the muzzle end of the barrel and with the bolt closed and the rod resting
on the face of the bolt mark the rod at the end of the muzzle and measure
the distance between the two marks?????? PS MAKE SURE THE GUN
IS UNLOADED !!!!!!!!!!!

Or, maybe just take it down and then measure the barrel length ❗

Bert

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August 12, 2013 - 3:46 pm
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It measures 19" from the muzzle to the end of the barrel, at the breech. In other words, if you took a tape measure and put the hook over the end of the barrel at the breech, with nothing else to measure, just the bare end of the barrel, and then read the tape at the muzzle, it would read 19". 😀

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August 12, 2013 - 3:53 pm
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I think everyone wants you to prove the barrel length by posting a picture with a tape measure on it, to clear things up.

Sincerely,
Maverick

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August 12, 2013 - 3:57 pm
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That means your rifle has a 19 inch barrel which was what was thought
in some of the earlier post but know you know for sure the exact length
as you measured it correctly .

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