A bunch of reasons for reloading |Page 2|Winchester Hunting, Shooting & Reloading|Forum|Winchester Collector

Bert H. said

Zebulon said

A “Maximum” load, in a perfect World, would be one that delivered the highest velocity from a cartridge made with a new, properly sized brass case, in a particular serial-numbered firearm, with maximum chamber pressure not exceeding the limit over which, if such loads were repeatedly fired,  [A] a SAAMI qualified NOGO headspace gauge would eventually close in the action; OR [B] the same case, reloaded repeatedly, would show signs of incipient head separation; whichever of A and B is the first to occur. 

We know it’s not a perfect World:  Even factory rifles of the same make, model, and caliber, vary in chamber dimensions. Different rifles of the same caliber can have barrels with different rates of twist. Canister powders vary in burn rate and pressure curve from batch to batch. Primers of different make vary in brisance. Bullets of the same caliber and weight can have varying amounts of bearing surface. Rough or pitted barrels can exhibit different pressure curves with the identical load. Fired cartridge cases do not always exhibit signs of “excessive” pressures until they rupture.  One rifle’s hot-safe load may damage another rifle. 

I had an early, memorable experience with a favorite Ruger 77RSI .250-3000 Savage.  It was a long time ago when I was even more ignorant than today. A popular published load for a Speer Hot-Cor 100 grain spitzer soft point was a certain quantity of Olin 760 ball powder. I loaded a small series, starting 10% below the recommended quantity and working up a half-grain at a time. I did not own a chronograph but, after the first shot, I didn’t need one.  The recoil in my little carbine was unusually sharp and I had hell’s own time getting the bolt open. The primer was flattened and extruded, too. Everything but a glowing skull and bones. Fortunately, I had sense enough not to proceed further, even though the powder charge was several grains below the published load. 

From the time of that experience forward, I did a lot of studying scholarly (and not so much) articles about chamber pressures and reloading and concluded that the edge of the cliff is not always visible in reloading manuals, even the “lawyer-mandated” manuals of recent years.

One of the things many “Gopher Baroque” [credit the late Dean Grennell] handloaders who rail about lawyer-mandated manuals usually haven’t done is read the relevant case law, which is tedious and has long words they have trouble sounding out.  Try explaining sometime to a senior corporate officer of a powder manufacturer why he should be bold and publish the razor’s edge number of grains … because the hundred million dollar verdict a California jury just laid on his competitor was merely because of “lawyer greed and stupid jurors”.  

Most senior corporate officers who have authority to bless or make those decisions would like to retire in comfort. They would not like to be the subject of a derisive Forbes article after their company underwent a Chapter 11 Arrangement to lose the judgment, which, in order to do so, wiped the value of the stock of the pre-filing shareholders to ZERO. Including said officer’s stock and the stock of his (former) pals in the C-suite.

Is it any wonder such an officer is not closely concerned whether you hit the gopher with 1500 foot pounds instead of, say, 1550?

So, what you are essentially telling us is that Adm. David Farragut’s axiom “Damm the Torpedoes, Full speed ahead” is not the right approach as it applies to reloading?

Bert

  

There are lots of Members with orders of magnitude more experience handloading than I’ve had and some of them have engineering degrees.  But what I think I’ve learned from experiments run and published by learned people whose opinions I respect, is:

1. There are no reliable amateur methods of recognizing excess chamber pressures.  Measuring case head expansion with a “tenths” capable, properly calibrated, micrometer, has been tried and debunked. Other “traditional” signs like flattened primers, hard bolt lift, et al. often tell us to back off only when we’re standing on the rim of the Void. 

2. Modern firearms from good manufacturers are designed to withstand much greater stresses than SAAMI spec ammunition produces. Cartridge wildcatters have a long and grisly history of producing magic designs that seemingly put Olin and Dupont to shame, the late Roy Weatherby not being the first among them. Eventually these rounds get tested in a reputable ballistics lab and the pressure barrel results turn our blood cold. In the case of the Remington 700 and the Weatherby Mark V, published overload tests show that, if we want to push the limits of a cartridge, these (and some others similar in design) are the safest to use. As much as I admire the original Winchester Model 70 and the 1898 Mauser, neither is a good candidate for that kind of envelope pushing, not to mention any of the WRA classic single shot and lever action rifles, original or replica. 

So, yes, at least when it comes to the Winchester guns and cartridges we both cherish, we should ignore Admiral Farragut’s command.  The old flag officer’s valor and leadership distinguished him and always will but he was able to see and appreciate the perils to his fleet and give orders accordingly. 

On the other hand, concocting the “real maximum load” for a High Wall’s 50-90 cartridge or a Model 70 Westerner’s .264 Magnum is essentially a blind man’s errand. A better analogy might be, a place where Angels with both eyes and  ten fingers should fear to tread. 

I’ve driven fast cars at speeds I won’t discuss in less than optimal conditions (public streets and highways) and I’m quite confident I’ve used up all my “pushing the limits” credits. I won’t push an old rifle whose history I have no way of knowing. I’m feeling lots of things at my age but “daring” is nowhere on the list. Food for thought: a firearm in good condition will quite possibly fire one “over max” round with no ill effects. Maybe more. Our member engineers can explain this better than I. All I know is that at some point things will go from together to apart at an incredible speed with rather destructive and often irreversible results and I don’t want to be there when it happens. 

Mike

Zeb, I agree.  That is why I have always used a chronograph and loaded my ammo at the black powder speed.  Not a true pressure test but that is as far as I want to go.