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Winchester Commemoratives from Canada as highly regarded as US production?
January 6, 2017
7:58 pm
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What I mean, is a Winchester produced in Canada as highly regarded as one produced in the US? I'm interested in a Winchester Commemorative Great Western Artist I or II but I dislike the fact that the guns were not produced in the US. I really would like to read your opinions. Maybe I'm too fussy...?

January 9, 2017
1:44 am
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I could be wrong, but I believe that no Winchester commeroratives were ever produced in Canada. There are commemorative Winchesters commemorating Canadian history, but they are produced at the same factory that the other non-Canadian history commemoratives are produced.

January 9, 2017
2:45 am
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You are absolutely wrong, sorry. Lots of commemoratives were produced in Canada.

January 9, 2017
2:53 am
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Peter Thomas said
You are absolutely wrong, sorry. Lots of commemoratives were produced in Canada.  

Peter,

I have no problem when someone posts contradictory answers... but when you do it, provide your reference source(s), or specific verifiable examples.

Bert

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January 9, 2017
3:00 am
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I have no knowledge of this, but like many topics raised here, this one led to a bit of Internet meandering on a Sunday evening. 

It appears there was some Olin owned manufacturing of rifles in Canada for a period of time. Not much detail and we know how awesome the info on the modern Winchester site is. 

http://www.winchesterguns.com/support/faq/where-are-winchester-firearms-manufactured.html

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January 9, 2017
3:45 am
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Winchester did own one manufacturing facility in Canada, with that factory located in Cobourg Ontario. Olin purchased the Cooey Firearms Company of Cobourg, one of Canada's oldest and most respected names in firearms, in April 1961. Winchester-Canada was established at the time for the manufacture and marketing of Cooey and Winchester sporting arms and ammunition in Canada. However, and to the best of my knowledge, there were no Model 94 commemoratives produced there. Production of "Winchester" labeled firearms at Cobourg factory primarily consisted of the Model 370 and Model 37A single shot shotguns. Winchester (Olin) divested itself of the Cobourg factory in 1979 (in preparation of getting completely out of the firearms manufacturing business in early 1981). No firearms have been manufactured in Canada with the "Winchester" name on them since 1979. Again, all of the Model 94 commemoratives manufactured from 1964 through 1981 (including the 1967 Canadian Centennial) were manufactured at the New Haven, CT factory to the best of my knowledge. If anyone has definitive proof to the contrary, please provide it.

Bert

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January 9, 2017
6:31 am
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January 9, 2017
5:07 pm
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Peter Thomas said
http://www.commemorativecollectors.com/  

Peter,

I just inspected (primarily photographs) several of the various Canadian Issue Model 94 commemoratives, and in each case, the barrel is clearly marked "MADE IN NEW HAVEN. CONN. U.S.A."

The GCA of 1968 mandated that all firearms manufactured in the U.S.A., or imported from any other country, be clearly marked as to the country of origin.

You are mistakenly assuming that because the commemoratives listed on the link you posted are "Canadian Issues" that they were manufactured in Canada, and that is not an accurate assumption on your part.  I urge you to carefully look at the factory markings on the actual guns.

Bert

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January 13, 2017
5:22 am
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Wow! Does that mean my Texas commemoratives weren't made in Texas? All kidding aside, one of my best shooters is a commemorative purchased NIB (at a bargain price(!) and promptly fired with BP...staining the finish on the receiver). One of the best-kept secrets among collectors of commemorative Winchesters is that they are almost always excellent shooters...but most of them will never know.Wink

Many Winchester collectors aren't much interested in commemoratives. Yes, they're beautiful. They generally display excellent materials and workmanship. BUT....they're not classic or antique. I'm sorry, Peter, but collectors are fickle by nature. IMHO commemoratives are conceived and manufactured to appeal to folks who like collectable firearms. Many Winchester collectors have little interest in Winchesters made after 1963 or 1964.

Buy what you like, Peter. Like what you buy. My Winchester collection includes US-made post-64 leverguns, a few modern bolt rifles and pump shotguns but the most interesting guns were putting venison on the table when my grandparents were quite young.

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February 6, 2017
1:20 am
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Very interesting thread.  I just started collecting Winchester rifles and purchased my 1st commemorative, the Bat Masterson.  From everything I have read, including the link that shows it was produced in Canada, and the Blue Book of Gun Values (which also lists that commemorative as being produced in Canada) left me a little confused at first when reading this post.  The barrel is clearly marked New Haven, CT and there are no import marks anywhere on the rifle that I can find, which would be required since it was produced after the GCA 1968.  Regardless, the rifle is very well made and I am proud to have found it in my local gunshop.  They had just taken it in in trade.  The styrofoam box is in good condition and is marked to the gun's serial number but the manuals are missing and the sleve is in very rough condition.  I know both of those items effects the value to the commemorative collector, but then I got the rifle for $600.00 +tax.  I am now looking for a sleve in real good condition and the original manuals.  Any leads on where they can be found would be great!  Thank You.

February 6, 2017
11:38 pm
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 Seems to me, I have an old Winchester Model 94 box around here some where ,which is marked, assembled in Canada.My guess, the rifle parts were made in the USA, shipped to Canada and assembled there.It is possible that the finish work on the Canadian commemoratives was done in Canada as well.

 

 I have several old Winchester  ammunition boxes that are marked, Made in Canada,so it would appear that Winchester loaded ammunition in Canada as well, for a time. Whether the ammunition components were Made in Canada or the U.S.A. and shipped to Canada to be assembled ,I do not know.

February 7, 2017
4:47 am
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Relying on an amateur web site for information or a friend of a friend said, just leads to misinformation. In the book "The History of Winchester Firearms 1866 to 1992" by Thomas Henshaw , it is clearly stated that all model 94 (including the 9422) commemoratives were made in New Haven CT.

Once again, just look on the barrel of the gun in question. My Winchester 22's made in Canada say so on the barrel.

Vince
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February 8, 2017
2:48 am
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Thanks for the input Vince.  Even though I am new to Winchester collecting, I know if it was made/assembled in Canada then brought back, the gun would have had to have import marks somewhere per GCA 1968.  While my sleeve is in real bad shape, the tag on the styrofoam box is still intact and clearly shows "Made in USA".  

February 10, 2017
2:10 am
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 I live about 2 hours from the old Cooey plant in Cobourg Ontario and am old enough to well remember when they sold out to Winchester in 1961 mainly for the  Canadian distribution of ammunition and Winchester firearms Beginning in June 11, 1970 they started manufacturing , shotguns, .22 rifles etc. and commemoratives, starting with the 2 Northwest Territories issues, Yellow boy, 4 R.C.M.P issues,Apache, 3 Klondyke Gold Rush issues, Sioux, little Big Horn, 2 Cheyenne issues, and ending in 1978 with 2 Cherokee issues. I remember thinking at the time it was strange they would build U.S. commemoratives in Canada and Canadian commemoratives in the U.S. I know they also built many other Winchester models at the Cooey plant but Ican't begin to tell You which ones, a lot of .22 cal. models and shotguns  At that time in order to obtain a Winchester Commemorative in Canada, it would be ordered through My gun shop(dealer), who in turn had to order through His U.S. distributor. I don't remember all of the politics involved but I do remember that a Canadian Centennial rifle was About $10.00 cheaper,( $99.00)in Port Huron Michigan than it was in Clinton Ontario at Ellwood Epps Gun Shop. That was My first commemorative and I have had about 450 since then. Now how about the European editions, Statue of Liberty, 1 of 1000, 1 of 1000 European ,etc. and how were they handled. And just for the hell of it check out the price on a Statue of Liberty, a U.S. Constitution or a 1 of 1000 if You can find one.       Harry

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June 15, 2018
6:24 pm
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G. Scott Jamieson
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Dear members,

I am the author of BULLARD ARMS (1988) and BULLARD FREARMS (2002) and am presently working on a project near and dear to my heart.  The book will be called 'COOEY ARMS- H.W. Cooey Machine and Arms Company 1903 - 1980 including the Winchester-Western (Canada) years'

My book will cover ALL the firearms the company manufactured or finished up in Cobourg, Ontario, Canada.  Included will be all the Winchester models produced in Cobourg form their purchase of the Cooey Company in 1961 as a result of the untimely and early death of the founder's son Hubert Cooey.

The following Winchester commemoratives were completed in Canada and were never advertised in the U.S. as they were mainly destined for the European markets.  This is a whole new avenue for Winchester Commemorative Collectors.  The Commemoratives include the North West Territories; the RCMP commemorative; Apache, Klondike, Comanche, Little Big Horn, Sioux, Cheyenne 94 and 9422, Cherokee and Cherokee 9422 and possibly Yellow Boy.  Yellow Boy is still a mystery to me.  I have records showing what came out of New Haven to be shipped to Cobourg and what Cobourg did to finish these Commemoratives mentioned above.  I will publish some of these documents, publishing them all would make for too large a book.  Many of the Winchester 94's including the antique model 94 were assembled in Cobourg too. 

Also covered will be the Model 84 shotgun which led to Winchester morphing it into the Model 840 for Canadian and European consumption and which became the Model 370 and then 37A in the U.S.  Make no mistake ALL of the above shotguns named were Hubert Cooey's design for the Model 84 launched in 1948!!  Also covered will be the Winchester Model 490 semi-auto .22 the Model 2200 and 2400 shotguns (the Model 1200 and 1400 respectively in the U.S).  The model 1370 shotgun, the Model 370T for Thailand.  Cooey had lots of experience building shotguns as they built Iver Johnson shotguns from the early 1920's to approximately 1940 for the Canadian and British Empire market.  These are marked made in Cobourg and carried the Ranger, Hercules Grade and Champion brand names. 

Also covered will be the Cooey Model 71 and 710 equivalent to the Model 70 in the U.S.  Also in the .22 range will be the Cooey 64B semi auto being made today by Savage in Canada, the Sears model 6C and 8C (really the Cooey Model 64B again).

I hope to have a manuscript out to publishers by the end of 2018.  Also hopefully this will put to rest the questions and answers about what was and was not made in Canada after Olin's purchase of the Cooey firm as my book will reveal all that I have learned on this subject.  Winchester-Western also produced ammunition in Cobourg as well.  

Best regards,

 

G. Scott Jamieson

 

  

April 4, 2019
11:04 pm
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G. Scott Jamieson said
Dear members,

I am the author of BULLARD ARMS (1988) and BULLARD FREARMS (2002) and am presently working on a project near and dear to my heart.  The book will be called 'COOEY ARMS- H.W. Cooey Machine and Arms Company 1903 - 1980 including the Winchester-Western (Canada) years'

My book will cover ALL the firearms the company manufactured or finished up in Cobourg, Ontario, Canada.  Included will be all the Winchester models produced in Cobourg form their purchase of the Cooey Company in 1961 as a result of the untimely and early death of the founder's son Hubert Cooey.

The following Winchester commemoratives were completed in Canada and were never advertised in the U.S. as they were mainly destined for the European markets.  This is a whole new avenue for Winchester Commemorative Collectors.  The Commemoratives include the North West Territories; the RCMP commemorative; Apache, Klondike, Comanche, Little Big Horn, Sioux, Cheyenne 94 and 9422, Cherokee and Cherokee 9422 and possibly Yellow Boy.  Yellow Boy is still a mystery to me.  I have records showing what came out of New Haven to be shipped to Cobourg and what Cobourg did to finish these Commemoratives mentioned above.  I will publish some of these documents, publishing them all would make for too large a book.  Many of the Winchester 94's including the antique model 94 were assembled in Cobourg too. 

Also covered will be the Model 84 shotgun which led to Winchester morphing it into the Model 840 for Canadian and European consumption and which became the Model 370 and then 37A in the U.S.  Make no mistake ALL of the above shotguns named were Hubert Cooey's design for the Model 84 launched in 1948!!  Also covered will be the Winchester Model 490 semi-auto .22 the Model 2200 and 2400 shotguns (the Model 1200 and 1400 respectively in the U.S).  The model 1370 shotgun, the Model 370T for Thailand.  Cooey had lots of experience building shotguns as they built Iver Johnson shotguns from the early 1920's to approximately 1940 for the Canadian and British Empire market.  These are marked made in Cobourg and carried the Ranger, Hercules Grade and Champion brand names. 

Also covered will be the Cooey Model 71 and 710 equivalent to the Model 70 in the U.S.  Also in the .22 range will be the Cooey 64B semi auto being made today by Savage in Canada, the Sears model 6C and 8C (really the Cooey Model 64B again).

I hope to have a manuscript out to publishers by the end of 2018.  Also hopefully this will put to rest the questions and answers about what was and was not made in Canada after Olin's purchase of the Cooey firm as my book will reveal all that I have learned on this subject.  Winchester-Western also produced ammunition in Cobourg as well.  

Best regards,

 

G. Scott Jamieson

 

    

Scott how is the book going?  I am still looking for definite information on where the Bat Masterson Commerative was actually produced.  I am still find conflicting nformation about if it was made in New Haven or Cobourg, Ontario.  I would like to ad concrete evidence to my file on this rifle.  My SN: BM4929. It is a shame that the wincheter Museum in Cody is not able to produce letters for the Commeratives, or so I have read.....

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