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What Manufacturer Made this Rifle
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April 20, 2020 - 8:39 pm
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Who made this rifle??

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April 20, 2020 - 9:39 pm
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It’s not a M70?

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April 20, 2020 - 10:49 pm
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Sure look’s like a model 70 to me. What am I missing?

Steve

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April 21, 2020 - 9:56 am
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Winchester?

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April 21, 2020 - 10:31 am
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looks like a remington 721 to me.

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April 21, 2020 - 12:53 pm
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Beginning to think Chuck has given us a trick question!

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April 21, 2020 - 1:05 pm
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Yep, sure looks like a Winchester Model 70 to me also.  Added white line/pad and missing front sight hood but otherwise looks like it is run of the mill.

Regards,

WACA Life Member #6284 - Specializing in Pre-64 Winchester .22 Rimfire

http://rimfirepublications.com/  

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April 21, 2020 - 7:37 pm
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I trust that Chuck knows the answer to this little quiz.  But I just love being wrong, so I’ll make a guess and then he can tell us the correct answer. Laugh

Model 70, standard rifle (characteristic checkering pattern) with looks like a Monte Carlo stock and an added Pachmayr recoil pad.  Now the tricky part…  The front sight ramp looks like it might be the longer integral one rather than the shorter brazed on variety. If so, the combination of MC stock and integral ramp would date the rifle to 1952-53 (roughly the 220000 to 245000 serial number range if a common chambering). 

Then there’s the chambering…  Can’t see the top of the action, of course, but the distance from the fore end tip to the muzzle appears longer than from the breech end of the barrel to the fore end, so I’m guessing a 26″ barrel?  That would make it a 300 H&H MAGNUM or 220 SWIFT, and since the owner is standing over a deceased moose I’m not thinking Swift.

Finally, the scope is a B&L Balvar 2.5-8X in what?  Leupold Adjusto-Mounts?

OK Chuck… How far off am I???  The ramp and barrel length are pretty uncertain guesses.  Wink

Lou

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April 21, 2020 - 8:25 pm
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Louis Luttrell said
I trust that Chuck knows the answer to this little quiz.  But I just love being wrong, so I’ll make a guess and then he can tell us the correct answer. Laugh

Model 70, standard rifle (characteristic checkering pattern) with looks like a Monte Carlo stock and an added Pachmayr recoil pad.  Now the tricky part…  The front sight ramp looks like it might be the longer integral one rather than the shorter brazed on variety. If so, the combination of MC stock and integral ramp would date the rifle to 1952-53 (roughly the 220000 to 245000 serial number range if a common chambering). 

Then there’s the chambering…  Can’t see the top of the action, of course, but the distance from the fore end tip to the muzzle appears longer than from the breech end of the barrel to the fore end, so I’m guessing a 26″ barrel?  That would make it a 300 H&H MAGNUM or 220 SWIFT, and since the owner is standing over a deceased moose I’m not thinking Swift.

Finally, the scope is a B&L Balvar 2.5-8X in what?  Leupold Adjusto-Mounts?

OK Chuck… How far off am I???  The ramp and barrel length are pretty uncertain guesses.  Wink

Lou  

LaughLaughLaugh

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April 23, 2020 - 7:08 pm
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Louis Luttrell said
I trust that Chuck knows the answer to this little quiz.  But I just love being wrong, so I’ll make a guess and then he can tell us the correct answer. Laugh

Model 70, standard rifle (characteristic checkering pattern) with looks like a Monte Carlo stock and an added Pachmayr recoil pad.  Now the tricky part…  The front sight ramp looks like it might be the longer integral one rather than the shorter brazed on variety. If so, the combination of MC stock and integral ramp would date the rifle to 1952-53 (roughly the 220000 to 245000 serial number range if a common chambering). 

Then there’s the chambering…  Can’t see the top of the action, of course, but the distance from the fore end tip to the muzzle appears longer than from the breech end of the barrel to the fore end, so I’m guessing a 26″ barrel?  That would make it a 300 H&H MAGNUM or 220 SWIFT, and since the owner is standing over a deceased moose I’m not thinking Swift.

Finally, the scope is a B&L Balvar 2.5-8X in what?  Leupold Adjusto-Mounts?

OK Chuck… How far off am I???  The ramp and barrel length are pretty uncertain guesses.  Wink

Lou  

Lou, I do not know, that is why I asked. I’m serious.  I may be able to find some other shots of the gun if someone would like to see more.  I do not want to misrepresent the model for something I’m putting together.  I only own one bolt action rifle and it is over 100 years old. It would be really cool if this is a Winchester. I do know that this gun was used on quite a few hunts from Canada to Mexico.  This guy shot more animals than most, I guarantee it.

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April 25, 2020 - 2:52 pm
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I have a great eye for detail and can tell that is a Pre-war Hornet. 

It is also a very nice elk…

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April 25, 2020 - 6:16 pm
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Chuck said 

  I may be able to find some other shots of the gun if someone would like to see more. 

Unnecessary–it’s a 70.  The info Lou provided is far beyond what I would have been able to deduce from the photo alone.

But actually, I think the moose is more exceptional than the rifle.  And if the head was well-mounted, I think it might be worth more than the rifle; around here (not moose country!) they best specimens sell for between 2 & 3 Gs in the antique stores.

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April 25, 2020 - 10:36 pm
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http://archives.tamuk.edu/ead.php?xml=peeler%20ead

Go to the bottom of the page and click view under Inventory.  Hope you have plenty of time.

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April 26, 2020 - 12:20 am
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Chuck said
Hope you have plenty of time.  

How ’bout a summary?

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April 26, 2020 - 2:58 am
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Shrapnel said
I have a great eye for detail and can tell that is a Pre-war Hornet. 

It is also a very nice elk…  

Hi Shrapnel-

Thanks for the satire… Very fine “elk” indeed…

Yes, I know I made an “educated” (or perhaps merely arrogant) guess.  As for my chambering speculation, the two rifles in my signature field below (apart from chambering) differ in that one on on top has a 26″ barrel (’36 dated CMS 220 SWIFT) and the bottom one has a 24″ barrel (’37 dated CMS barrel in a chambering that was not cataloged).  Check the breech to fore end tip and fore end tip to muzzle ratios.  That’s what my “guess” is based upon…

Since the Hornet had a 24″ barrel I’d not considered it as a front line elk gun…  My Bad…  Wink

Cheers Laugh

Lou

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April 26, 2020 - 7:32 pm
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clarence said

How ’bout a summary?  

I’m writing one.

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April 26, 2020 - 7:43 pm
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Chuck said

I’m writing one.  

Good.  Remember “brevity is the soul of wit.”

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April 26, 2020 - 7:47 pm
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clarence said

Good.  Remember “brevity is the soul of wit.”  

Yes and that is just one issue that bothers me.  Never done this before.

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May 1, 2020 - 1:19 pm
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Check out the staples in the sling keepers.  They appear to be “diamond” shaped staples that Winchester used.  Am I correct or not?  Roger B.

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May 1, 2020 - 10:01 pm
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Hi All-

Last weekend I followed up on Chuck’s suggestion and flipped through all the photos in the Graves Peeler archives.  There are (at least) two other kills photographed with that rifle, a Grizzly and a Mountain Goat.  Probably from the same hunt as the Moose.  The archive date on the photos is 1962.  Most that include the rifle are out of focus, as the rifle is mostly pictured in Mr. Peeler’s hands and apparently he (not the guides) was the only one who knew how to focus the camera.  The Grizzly (and the additional moose) photos aren’t too helpful, but below are two from the goat hunt that might help address the OP question:

Goat-1.jpgImage EnlargerGoat-2-1.jpgImage Enlarger

While not conclusive, I’ll offer an amendment to my initial impression…  I now think that the front sight ramp is the shorter brazed-on variety.  Gimme a break… We’re talking about judging 1/4″ in length with no hope of seeing whether the side of the ramp has the shallow grooves of the integral ramp or not!!!.  Wink

That would make the DOM much broader, from about 1953 through 1959 (S/N range about 245,000-520,000).  It’s not likely later than 1960-61 since it has hand checkering, although the hand checkered stocks for specialized chamberings like the 300 H&H MAGNUM (b/c of the longer magazine well) lasted a bit longer before the switch to machine cut narrow panel checkering. Since it’s got a non-factory recoil pad I’ve no hope of telling whether the original butt plate was steel or plastic.

Based on the second photo, however, I’ll go out on a limb again… To my eye the barrel finish looks matte and the muzzle is bright.  I’d say stainless barrel…  FWIW… the 300 H&H MAGNUM was not routinely made with a stainless barrel.  The 220 SWIFT was, but I still can’t buy the idea of a Swift being used for moose/grizzly.  So I’m thinking this was a 300 H&H MAGNUM with a special order stainless barrel.  I’ve got one such, so they can’t be all that “rare”…

Still waiting for the definitive answer… LaughLaughLaugh

Lou

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