Avatar
Please consider registering
Guest
Search
Forum Scope




Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
Register Lost password?
sp_Feed sp_PrintTopic sp_TopicIcon
1873 and 1886 Rear Sight Questions
sp_NewTopic Add Topic
Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 10
Member Since:
August 12, 2022
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
1
January 30, 2024 - 8:35 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

I have had some lingering questions with a couple of rifles I’ve acquired over the years and was hoping to get some guidance on the originality of a couple of the rear sights.

First, the 1886 sight shown in the attached photo appears to be correct based on length (it’s from an 88k serial range standard 26″ rifle), but what puzzles me is that the screw is in the center of the top portion of the sight and not offset like the other sights.  Is this normal?

Second is regarding a sight on an 18k serial range 1873 rifle.  I took a photo of the sight it has on it next to one that I have on a 209k serial range rifle (which I believe is correct, although I discovered later that the elevator came from another rifle but I believe this is still correct as both match the dimensions on an early 1892 rifle I have).  The sight on the left is from the first model 1873, and clearly shorter, and this particular sight is completely flat on the top, and has a series of hash marks in an “x” type pattern on the sides.  Is this first model sight and elevator original to a first model gun?

Last is from a late production (700k serial range) short rifle I picked up.  I took a photo of the sight next to the same 209k serial range 1873 for comparison.  The short rifle sight is plainer without the striations on the side of the 209k range sight and also angled backwards at the top.  The elevator it came with was clearly wrong, so I’m also looking to replace it with an original that would have been appropriate for that sight, but wanted to know if the sight it currently has would be correct for that serial range or not, and if so, if it would take the same type of elevator with the thumbpiece found on other winchesters in the early 1900’s?

 

1873-Short-Rifle-vs.-Standard-v2.jpgImage Enlarger1886-Rifle-Sight-v2.jpgImage Enlarger1873-1st-vs-3rd-v2.jpgImage Enlarger

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1690
Member Since:
June 4, 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
2
January 30, 2024 - 9:54 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

  The 1886 photo shows a sporting leaf sight and the screw is in the right place. The photos are poor but that series of sight is found on many 1873s, 1876s, and 1886s. They can be marked or sometimes not.

  The first model 1873 rifle commonly used the short sporting rear sight, with the checkering . Sometimes they were flat tops, clover leaf, or semi buckhorn. The elevator had flat steps. They were also used on 66s and 76s.

  Because of the poor pictures I can’t tell for sure what you have.

                                    T/R

Avatar
Wisconsin
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 4256
Member Since:
May 2, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
3
January 31, 2024 - 12:36 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

Grant,

The sight on the 209k gun has a non Winchester elevator on it. It should have one like this.

sloped-elevator.jpgImage Enlarger

The sight on the 1st model has the wrong elevator as well. It should have the flat step kind like this one.

flat-elevator.jpgImage Enlarger

 

The picture of the short rifle sight is too blurry and the wrong angle to see what kind of sight it is. Take a angled picture like the one I posted of the 1st model sight. Make sure its sharp before you post it.

Bob

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
WACA Life Member---
NRA Life Member----
Cody Firearms member since 1991
Researching the Winchester 1873's

73_86cutaway.jpg

Email: [email protected]

Avatar
ME
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 477
Member Since:
March 14, 2022
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
4
January 31, 2024 - 10:17 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

Not sure if this is the same. This is the rear sight on my 73 rifle DOM 1882. It has the knurls & not serrations. 

 

IMG_5646.jpegImage EnlargerIMG_5643.jpegImage Enlarger

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments

 RickC 

   

Avatar
Wisconsin
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 4256
Member Since:
May 2, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
5
January 31, 2024 - 10:33 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

That would be on a 1st or some 2nd model guns.

Bob

WACA Life Member---
NRA Life Member----
Cody Firearms member since 1991
Researching the Winchester 1873's

73_86cutaway.jpg

Email: [email protected]

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1690
Member Since:
June 4, 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
6
January 31, 2024 - 10:39 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

RickC said
Not sure if is this the same. This is the rear sight on my 73 rifle DOM 1882. It has the knurls & not serrations. 

 

IMG_5646.jpegImage EnlargerIMG_5643.jpegImage Enlarger

  

  Yes, this is the early sporting rear sight with the flat step elevator. It still appeared in the June 1883 catalog, price $1.00.

                                  T/R

Avatar
ME
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 477
Member Since:
March 14, 2022
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
7
January 31, 2024 - 10:42 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

TR said

RickC said

Not sure if is this the same. This is the rear sight on my 73 rifle DOM 1882. It has the knurls & not serrations. 

 

IMG_5646.jpegImage EnlargerIMG_5643.jpegImage Enlarger

  

  Yes, this is the early sporting rear sight with the flat step elevator. It still appeared in the May 1881 catalog, price $1.00.

                                  T/R

  

Ok thanks Bob & T/R, pretty sure it’s original on my 73 DOM 1882.

 RickC 

   

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1690
Member Since:
June 4, 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
8
January 31, 2024 - 10:55 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

  Rick I looked again and that sight appears in the June of 1883 catalog, but not in September 1884. T/R

Avatar
Wisconsin
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 4256
Member Since:
May 2, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
9
January 31, 2024 - 11:29 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Grant,

I can’t see what sight you have on your short rifle but this is what would be on one.

Bob

 

late-sporting-rear-2.jpgImage EnlargerLate-sporting-rear.jpgImage Enlarger

WACA Life Member---
NRA Life Member----
Cody Firearms member since 1991
Researching the Winchester 1873's

73_86cutaway.jpg

Email: [email protected]

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 10
Member Since:
August 12, 2022
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
10
February 1, 2024 - 6:52 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Thank you both, T/R and Bob for the replies.  Sorry that the first photos didn’t come out clear enough, couldn’t seem to get the lighting right, but hopefully this batch is better for both the first model and the late model short rifle.  I believe that the last photos you attached match what I have on the late model, but would love a second opinion.

Bob, I see now that there is a difference on the 209k rifle elevator vs. the 1892 rifle I had been comparing it to.  When I removed the elevators, the 1892 elevator matched the photo you attached and the one on the 1873 had the top part of the elevator too far forward vs. the base.

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 10
Member Since:
August 12, 2022
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
11
February 1, 2024 - 6:53 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Short-Rifle-Side.jpgImage Enlarger1st-Model-Rear.jpgImage Enlarger1st-Model-Side.jpgImage EnlargerShort-Rifle-Rear.jpgImage Enlarger

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
Wisconsin
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 4256
Member Since:
May 2, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
12
February 1, 2024 - 7:32 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

I can’t tell from your picture if it has the screw and slide adjuster.

Bob

Short-Rifle-Rear.jpgImage Enlarger

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
WACA Life Member---
NRA Life Member----
Cody Firearms member since 1991
Researching the Winchester 1873's

73_86cutaway.jpg

Email: [email protected]

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 10
Member Since:
August 12, 2022
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
13
February 1, 2024 - 11:46 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Sorry about that Bob, I can’t seem to get the camera to focus well enough in the lighting again.

The short rifle sight does have an adjustment screw on the right hand side like the photos you shared.  I looked really closely under a bright light, and could just barely make out that there are two vertical lines separating the center and the outsides of the buckhorn, same as your picture.  Until now, I had never seen those due to the….character…of the rifle.  

Not that I would attempt to move it now as it’s likely rusted solid, but I presume that this means that the adjustment screw would allow one to raise or lower the outside of the sight such that it could be a flat top or a high top buckhorn, correct?

I really appreciate the guidance here and sorry the pictures haven’t given all of the detail needed, but I’ve already learned a lot!  

Avatar
Wisconsin
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 4256
Member Since:
May 2, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
14
February 2, 2024 - 12:30 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Grant,

The adjuster is to do fine adjustments to the notch to get your point of impact zeroed in at close range and then you would use the elevator for the different ranges.

Bob

WACA Life Member---
NRA Life Member----
Cody Firearms member since 1991
Researching the Winchester 1873's

73_86cutaway.jpg

Email: [email protected]

Avatar
New Member
WACA Guest
Forum Posts: 1
Member Since:
February 22, 2024
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
15
February 22, 2024 - 7:28 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

I just inherited my Uncle Joes 1967 or 68. Model 94.  But I’m not sure what scope to mount on this rear hard site / scope mount combo.  Any suggestions?  [Image Can Not Be Found]

 

im not able to add a pic, but this is a single scope mount that is too thick to mount a picatany mount. This piece also has a hard site attached to the piece with Windage adj and elevation adj.  about 6” in length and provides for the front stock strap ring.  The look is that it’s original to the weapon. 

fyi front site is the raised w cover site 

Forum Timezone: UTC 0
Most Users Ever Online: 778
Currently Online: deerhunter, Ben, Paul K
Guest(s) 85
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
clarence: 6150
TXGunNut: 4861
Chuck: 4515
1873man: 4256
steve004: 4097
Big Larry: 2290
twobit: 2283
TR: 1690
mrcvs: 1656
Forum Stats:
Groups: 1
Forums: 17
Topics: 12498
Posts: 108493

 

Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 1727
Members: 8713
Moderators: 4
Admins: 3
Navigation