Avatar
Search
Forum Scope




Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
Lost password?
sp_Feed sp_PrintTopic sp_TopicIcon
Winchester 1893 Pump Shotgun
sp_NewTopic Add Topic
Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 33
Member Since:
May 5, 2023
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
1
August 17, 2023 - 10:40 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Is there much interest or value to the model 1893.  I read that they are supposed to be black powder 2 5/8″ shell guns.  I found a few priced over $1000 but the blu book says they ain’t worth much.  Have a local guy that’s selling one.  Haven’t seen it yet but will in the morning.  He wants me to make him an offer……ughhhh

Lonnie

Avatar
NY
Member
Restricted
Forum Posts: 7119
Member Since:
November 1, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
2
August 17, 2023 - 11:11 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Better than the Blue Book is finding out what they’re actually bringing on Gunbroker.  Smokeless was in use by 1893, so don’t know if that’s correct about them being built for BP.  Greater nuisance, if you wanted to shoot it, would be finding or making correct-length shells.

Avatar
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 11574
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
3
August 18, 2023 - 12:44 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Papalondog said
Is there much interest or value to the model 1893.  I read that they are supposed to be black powder 2 5/8″ shell guns.  I found a few priced over $1000 but the blu book says they ain’t worth much.  Have a local guy that’s selling one.  Haven’t seen it yet but will in the morning.  He wants me to make him an offer……ughhhh

Lonnie

The Model 1893 Slide-action shotguns were chambered for a 2-5/8″ maximum length shell, and for black powder only.  The Model 1897 was Winchester’s first shotgun specifically manufactured for smokeless powder.  The Model 1893 was purposefully replaced by the Model 1897 because of the transition to smokeless powder.

The configuration and the graded condition of the gun will dictate how much it is actually worth.  The Blue Book is a very poor reference source in regard to the valuations for most of the older Winchester models.  

As an FYI, I have been actively surveying the Model 1893 for the past 20-years, an wrote an article discussing them that was published in the Simmer 2017 WACA Collector magazine.  Currently, I have documented just (523) of the (34,180) that were manufactured.  Accordingly, I would appreciate learning what the serial number is on the gun you are being offered.

Bert

WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Great Basin
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 516
Member Since:
November 27, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
4
August 18, 2023 - 3:07 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Hi Bert,

I don’t think I’ve sent you info on the 1893 shotgun here on the ranch.  It’s a standard grade 12 gauge with a 32″ barrel.  SN 8679. Mark

Avatar
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 11574
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
5
August 18, 2023 - 3:24 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

Mark Douglas said
Hi Bert,

I don’t think I’ve sent you info on the 1893 shotgun here on the ranch.  It’s a standard grade 12 gauge with a 32″ barrel.  SN 8679. Mark

Yes, you were holding out on me!  It is in the survey now.  As it turns out, I picked up a really nice Model 1893 two weeks ago, another “A” series gun.  Your old gun is a “Pre A”.  I am looking for a “B” series gun, and a “B☆” series gun to add to my growing collection of 1893s.

Bert

WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 5004
Member Since:
March 31, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
6
August 18, 2023 - 4:49 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Do you have my B 25434 in your data?

Avatar
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 11574
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
7
August 18, 2023 - 5:14 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Chuck said
Do you have my B 25434 in your data?

  

Yes I do.

Thanks for checking.

WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 4667
Member Since:
November 19, 2006
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
8
August 18, 2023 - 5:52 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

I’ve never owned a M1893, but have owned M1897’s.  Historically, the M1893 is a significant piece.  A friend of mine has owned them and is truly excellent at exploring and understanding the mechanics of a firearm.  Here is a comment he made to me on the topic:

Have you ever wondered why they have that curved out section tin the top of the ejection port? I’ve read theories on that, one was it was to allow easier single loading, these people evidently never had one.  Having functional ones I found out the reason, the weak ejection often just turns the casing sideways in the action and the curved relief allows the next cartridge to kick the spent casing out as it feeds into the lifter. If you put a piece of masking tape over that relief the action will often jam and even without the tape it will sometimes jam on the last round because there isn’t another shell feeding in to kick it out. There is nothing on the left side of the bolt to hold the shell casing tight to the extractor so they have a very weak inconsistent ejection. 1897 have a spring loaded hook on the left side of the bolt and they will eject a casing across a room. Not sure if this was corrected on the B series 1893’s.

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 33
Member Since:
May 5, 2023
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
9
August 18, 2023 - 6:07 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

Well I bought it this morning.  Serial number B33467 so must be a very late gun.  Appears all original with most of the bluing gone.  Nice patina.  30 inch barrel. I don’t know if it has a really old rebluing job or just been scrubbed or if they weren’t really high polished to begin with.  Appears some buff marks on the receiver.  Approximate value?

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 33
Member Since:
May 5, 2023
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
10
August 18, 2023 - 6:16 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Won’t let me load PicsIMG_0901.jpegImage Enlarger

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 11574
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
11
August 18, 2023 - 7:13 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Papalondog said
Well I bought it this morning.  Serial number B33467 so must be a very late gun.  Appears all original with most of the bluing gone.  Nice patina.  30 inch barrel. I don’t know if it has a really old rebluing job or just been scrubbed or if they weren’t really high polished to begin with.  Appears some buff marks on the receiver.  Approximate value?

  

Interesting in that it is a very late gun but does not have the marking next to the “B”.  It was manufactured in January of 1897, and production of the Model 1893 ended in February of that year.

The receiver frame finish looks like it is original, and No, they were not a high polish finished gun.

I need to see more pictures of the gun (slide handle stock, butt stock, butt plate, roll marking on the barrel, etc.) to come up with an approximate value.

Bert

WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 11574
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
12
August 18, 2023 - 7:14 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Papalondog said
Won’t let me load PicsIMG_0901.jpegImage Enlarger

  

Your one picture that did load is right on the hairy edge for the maximum file size.  Your other pictures quite likely exceed the 3Mb limit.

Bert

WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 33
Member Since:
May 5, 2023
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
13
August 18, 2023 - 7:41 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

I’m old and no too bright but finally figured it out ?
IMG_3063.jpegImage EnlargerIMG_0904.jpegImage EnlargerIMG_0911.jpegImage EnlargerIMG_0908.jpegImage Enlarger

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 11574
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
14
August 18, 2023 - 8:12 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

It looks like it is original finish on the gun.  Even though finding a complete & functional Model 1893 is not an easy task these days, the going values for them is quite reasonable.  I suspect that you could expect to get at least $750 for it, maybe a bit more for a motivated buyer collector.

Bert

WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 33
Member Since:
May 5, 2023
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
15
August 18, 2023 - 10:09 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Thanks.  I have little interest in it and will probably post it for sale in the near future.  First is a week of early elk hunting ??

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 20
Member Since:
March 17, 2021
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
16
August 21, 2023 - 9:25 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Was Black Diamond wood ever offered on the Model 1893?

Avatar
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 11574
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
17
August 21, 2023 - 11:29 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

[email protected] said
Was Black Diamond wood ever offered on the Model 1893?

  

Fancy grain American Black Walnut wood was a special order item for the Model 1893, but it was very rarely ordered, and almost never had the Balck Diamond inlay.  The Black Diamond stocks were typically only used for the Trap and Pigeon grade guns.  There were just (9) Trap grade Model 1893 shot guns manufactured, and only (4) Pigeon grade guns.

This is one of the (9) late production Model 1893 Trap grade guns (S/N 34345);

Model-1893-Trap-grade-34345.jpgImage Enlarger

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments

WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 5004
Member Since:
March 31, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
18
August 22, 2023 - 4:15 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

Here are a couple pictures of my 93. 

Factory Letter:   States Close Shooter in comments.  Does not mention the fancy wood.

Notes:  The butt stock and forend are a much nicer that normal grade of wood.  On the underside of the butt plate there are two S’s, an 11, a 10 and an 0.  On the receiver end of the butt stock there is a 10.  On the butt end of the receiver there is a 10.  On the metal shaft that extends into the butt stock there is a S.

Winchester-1893-L.JPGImage EnlargerWinchester-1893-R.jpgImage Enlarger

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
Member
WACA Guest
Forum Posts: 21
Member Since:
December 25, 2016
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
19
August 25, 2023 - 10:03 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Wow, that’s special, nice condition I doubt I will look that good at 120 something…

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 20
Member Since:
March 17, 2021
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
20
August 29, 2023 - 3:38 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Thanks for the information.  An 1895 with Black Diamond wood was auctioned at Rock Island a few years ago.  Wanted it but could not find enough information to get past fear it was not original.

Forum Timezone: UTC 0
Most Users Ever Online: 4623
Currently Online: Bert H.
Guest(s) 459
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
clarence: 7119
TXGunNut: 5585
Chuck: 5004
steve004: 4667
1873man: 4472
Big Larry: 2447
twobit: 2350
mrcvs: 1949
TR: 1784
Forum Stats:
Groups: 1
Forums: 18
Topics: 13480
Posts: 119028

 

Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 1897
Members: 9283
Moderators: 4
Admins: 3
Navigation