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Bill,
I have surveyed a total of (376) transitional Carbines thus far, and of that number, (42) of them were 32 Winchester Specials. Doing the math, that implies that just over 11% of the total production were made in 32 WS. My estimate of the total production for the transitional carbines is 20,850. Many of the serial numbers in the Transitional range were assigned to Model 64s. If you use my production estimate of 20,580 transitional carbines, then multiply it by 11%, the extrapolated production number for the 32 WS would be approximately 2,300. The number of them still in 85% condition is undoubtedly a lot smaller than that.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Once again Bert, Thank you so much for the valuable information on transitional model 94. I will look for a trans model 94 in 32wcfd and if you see or hear of one please give me a email.
Thank you, Bill
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[email protected] said
Burt, Was 1938 the first year the hoods showed up on front sight? Tom
Tom,
No., it was not. The ramp style front sight with the hood was first used in May, 1932.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
This thread has contained some very fine and detailed information. Particular thanks to Bert for all he provided. Very interesting.
steve004 said
This thread has contained some very fine and detailed information. Particular thanks to Bert for all he provided. Very interesting.
Steve,
Thank you very much for the positive feedback, it is very much appreciated.
In regards to this topic, the information I posted was derived from my ongoing research surveys. Currently, I have just over 17,000 Model 1894/94 rifle & carbine serial number recorded in the survey (and more will be added at the end of my trip to this years Cody show). I also have 1,109 Model 55 rifles, and 2,420 Model 64 rifles in the survey. From this, I am able to develop relatively accurate production totals, and very specific serial number ranges & dates when Winchester made all of the notable production changes. I intend to publish an article with the up-to-date production ratios and number in the next few years for each of the models that I continue to survey. In the meantime, if anyone has specific questions, please ask.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
I recently found this site and am trying to learn as much as I can. I just got my first Winchester, Model 1894, and trying to find out more about it. Its serial number is 1266300, it has a 20” barrel and a serrated steel butt plate. It has “Model 94” and “30 WCF” on the barrel, a front ramp sight with hood, the step rear sight, along with an add-on Lyman adjustable peep sight behind that. It doesn’t have the saddle ring, the wood looks original, and I think the bluing is original also. There are also what looks to be proof marks on the barrel behind the rear sight. If anyone can tell me more about it, it would be much appreciated. Thank you in advance!
[email protected] said
I recently found this site and am trying to learn as much as I can. I just got my first Winchester, Model 1894, and trying to find out more about it. Its serial number is 1266300, it has a 20” barrel and a serrated steel butt plate. It has “Model 94” and “30 WCF” on the barrel, a front ramp sight with hood, the step rear sight, along with an add-on Lyman adjustable peep sight behind that. It doesn’t have the saddle ring, the wood looks original, and I think the bluing is original also. There are also what looks to be proof marks on the barrel behind the rear sight. If anyone can tell me more about it, it would be much appreciated. Thank you in advance!
Your new (old) Model 94 was manufactured in February of the year 1941. Your description of its features is perfectly as it should be with the exception of the Lyman peep sight. Is the Lyman sight mounted on the left side of the receiver, or is it on the upper tang behind the hammer? Does it have a “W” stamped below the serial number on the flat section of the receiver frame?
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Bert,
Thanks for the quick response!
The Lyman sight is mounted on the left side of the receiver, and there isn’t a “W” stamped on the bottom of the receiver near the serial number. I know you can’t give any type of estimate of its value without photos, but is there a possible range you can give, depending on its condition?
Thanks again for the help. This is my first Winchester, but it definitely has me more excited that any other purchase.
Bob
Bob,
I really do need to see several clear detailed pictures of your Carbine to provide a reasonably accurate value estimate. Can you tell me which specific Lyman sight variation is mounted on your Carbine? If the sight was added/installed aftermarket (and most of them were), the value in the collector market will take a negative hit. That stated, there is a possibility that it was special ordered with the Lyman receiver mounted peep sight. What (if anything) is mounted in the rear sight dovetail on the barrel?
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Bert,
I think it was added afterwards, because the original rear sight is still on. Hopefully these photos will help.
Bob,
Your pictures did not post. You can send them directly to me at [email protected]
Because your Model 94 Carbine has an original rear sight, the Lyman receiver mounted peep sight is very unlikely to be factory original.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Bert,
I just emailed you the photos. I figured that if the original sight was still there, then the Lyman was probably an add-on. Thank you again for your time and information!
Bob
Bert H. said
Bill,I have surveyed a total of (376) transitional Carbines thus far, and of that number, (42) of them were 32 Winchester Specials. Doing the math, that implies that just over 11% of the total production were made in 32 WS. My estimate of the total production for the transitional carbines is 20,850. Many of the serial numbers in the Transitional range were assigned to Model 64s. If you use my production estimate of 20,580 transitional carbines, then multiply it by 11%, the extrapolated production number for the 32 WS would be approximately 2,300. The number of them still in 85% condition is undoubtedly a lot smaller than that.
Bert
Bert,
I’m not sure if you have my transitional carbine in your survey. Serial #1085815, . 30 wcf.
Al
Al,
I did have it in the survey.
Thanks,
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Hi Bert,
If you are still adding transitional carbines to your survey, here’s another one:
SN 1105917 in 30 WCF. Fits all standard characteristics of the type. 1936 barrel dated.
Matt,
Thanks… it is a new entry in the survey. The PR date matches up perfectly with the barrel date.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Hi Bert! Just reviewing this Thread info on my favorite pattern 94 which I’d not recalled labeled “Transitional”. Noting from your second Post of this Thread in terms of SN spread as presumably of that Post dated 30 Aug ’16, reflecting (then) highest SN of “1129750”. Mine previously reported: “1129740” & believe you’d told me made in ’38. Perhaps SN similarity a coincidence or misnomer? I’d expect by now a new high number, but any case to insure your record straight!
Also a question on the subject of my edition of this sub-model. I’ve somewhere read that they were factory offered with the King series aft barrel sights. Mine equipped with such, pix below. Wondering if it could be original to my carbine. Would definitely be a ‘hoot’ but even if not, likely ‘nesting’ since prewar era and not disturb such artifact. Plus the fact particularly as full buckhorn style, befitting the mantle “Gnarly!” 🙂
A few pix illustrating the Transitional differences depicted, perhaps as reference. Such: “Winchester Proof Steel” barrel annotation; ramp barrel-forward sight; couple reflecting hoped-original factory King barrel-aft sight & Carbine stern ‘butt shot’!
Best!
John
John,
Your Transitional Carbine was manufactured in early June 1936, and it is near the very tail-end of the “Transitional” Carbine production run. I am not aware that Winchester ever used the King sight that is on your Carbine.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Thanks as ever Bert for your kind response, expertise and useful DOB info! 🙂
Those Transitionals, with something old, something new, the King sight borrowed as the cariune yet mostly blue… Reaffirming my position, to keep it original as likely “prewar modified”. Such on my watch!
Best!
John
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