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February 29, 2016
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I am soon getting a Winchester 1885 low wall .22 short made 1911. the buttstock on it appears too small at the wrist. i.e. Metal at the tangs is proud to the wood. Would this be an early Low Wall stock someone may have tried to modify to put on a late Low Wall? Or maybe someone sanded the wrist. At any rate, I’m reading that the stocks are different between the early models and the late models. The early frames being smaller with thinner tangs. Where would a 1911 Low Wall be in terms of early or late? I’ve also been reading a later 3rd model had the same frame as the High Wall and used the same stock. I’m confused and need to sort this out , so I can get a replacement stock. I’m thinking that the frame on my rifle may be the same dimensions as the later Winder model, which would take the same buttstock as a High Wall, but again I’m not sure. Need help.
It sounds like the stock on your low-wall was sanded. No, your low-wall is not the early variation, nor is it the late variation. It is the middle variation, and a stock from a Winder Musket will not fit properly (or be the correct type).
To be more specific, there were three variations of the low-wall receiver frame that were manufactured.
The 1st variation was relatively short lived, and is found in the 2500 – 17500 serial number range. The stock is thicker and larger than the stock for the 2nd variation.
The 2nd variation comprised the majority of the low-wall rifles made, and is found in the 17500 – 120000 serial range. The stock is the thinnest and lightest found on and Model 1885.
The 3rd variation low-wall was used for the Model 87 Winder Muskets only, and was actually a high-wall frame milled to look like a low-wall (the 3rd variation stock is interchangeable with any high-wall stock).
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
February 29, 2016
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Thank you Bert. Looks like I’ll be looking for a while for another stock
I have found over the years, that buying an old Winchester that has incorrect or damaged beyond repair wood, and then trying to find correct wood that fits, can be totally frustrating, costly, and never seems to end well for me. It is especially bad if there are two pieces of wood involved and you are only getting one. Getting them to fit is hard enough…getting them to match in color and finish is totally another thing. Peter
February 29, 2016
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I know.what you mean. What makes this one especially difficult is that I found the same rifle in the Madis book. Al least I know what to look for. I guess someone took its stock. Thanks Peter
The easiest solution might be to get a Precision Gun Works (precisiongunstocks.com) stock blank and fit yourself or have someone do it for you. I use PGW because they provide blanks with the best inletting of all the ones I’ve tried.
"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."
February 29, 2016
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I just looked at PGW’s website. I’m wondering if their cresent butt Low Wall is for the 2nd variation, which is the more predominant, as Bert pointed out. I wonder if someone has actually bought a Low Wall stock from them. Customer comments are very positive. I’ll contact them by email, but it would be good to hear from someone who has actually bought this particular stock.
I bought a stock recently from “COTTAGE CRAFT WORKS”. I would NOT by one of their products again. Peter
If you are talking about the length of the upper tang on the buttplate, they are cut for the short tang. If you have a long buttplate tang you cut out the difference from the top of the wood.
"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."
February 29, 2016
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I can’t be sure until I have the rifle in my hands. I was under the impression there was a difference in the receiver tangs.
All replacement buttstocks are cut so that the exterior dimensions are oversized and the inletting is approximately 95% so it doesn’t matter what receiver you have; you fit and finish your blank for the gun you are working on. There is no such thing as a drop-in replacement stock. Some of the makers, not PGW, leave so much extra wood on the blank that there is no point in buying a High Wall blank from them as there will be way too much extra wood to sand down, even if you are using it for an actual High Wall rifle.
"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."
February 29, 2016
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One customer of PGW said he got a precise fit at the tang on his Low Wall stock. If that’s so, that would be good. I may get lucky and find an original somewhere.
you might want to remember that “original” does NOT mean it will fit correctly. They were all hand fitted at the factory. You might get an original that is to small in some areas, and that’s not good either.
February 29, 2016
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I’ll try to post a picture of the rifle when I get it.
February 29, 2016
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I just received the rifle. It’s very rainy outside, so I can’t take pictures. I was told the stock looked like a modified High Wall stock, but the colors match perfectly, and the rifle looks like it has been well loved. The rifling is clean, but worn. Not worn out. It could be the wrist area is simply worn down. The shotgun type buttplate has the checkering worn off if it had checkering in the first place.
By the way, did the Low Wall come with the shotgun buttplate as an option?
I was wondering if I would like this rifle, but I’m thinking maybe it’s original but worn. It’s one out of the U.S.C.Co. collection. Not the same one as in the Madis book. I will post pictures at the first opportunity.
Yes, the low-wall variations were made with shotgun butt stocks on special order. What is the serial number?
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
February 29, 2016
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Bert H. said
Yes, the low-wall variations were made with shotgun butt stocks on special order. What is the serial number?
Bert
#102922. As you can see, the wrist, at the tang, is quite worn as well as the buttplate, but I think original.
Here are pictures hopefully:
http://s287.photobucket.com/user/straycatcdr/slideshow/Winchester%201885%20Low%20Wall%2022%20short
The stock and shotgun butt on your low-wall are original, and the is butt plate supposed to be smooth (no checkering). The wrist area of the stock has been sanded and refinished.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
February 29, 2016
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Bert H. said
The stock and shotgun butt on your low-wall are original, and the is butt plate supposed to be smooth (no checkering). The wrist area of the stock has been sanded and refinished.
Bert
I think there is a lot of wear on the buttplate and the wood. Some people shoot with their right thumb along the tang. I don’t, but I’ve noticed that over the years. That’s where most of the wear is: to the right of the upper tang. As for the buttplate, I believe checkering would normally be there, but appears worn down. I’ve seen more than my share of military rifles with the checkering on the butt stock worn smooth. Who knows Winchester may have made this one that way, but I doubt it. The wood has been revarnished because there is varnish on the buttplate. The buttplate has been reblued, but I don’t know why. None of the rest of the metal was refinished.The throat of the barrel is so worn, it will accept a .22lr. Of course, someone may have reamed it to .22lr. The rifling actually looks quite good. I believe I will keep it. The more I look at it, the more I like it. I’ve never had one of these before. The action is silky smooth and tight, and I got it at a decent price. I may get a new butylate if I can find one. Are these buttplates common to any other Winchesters?
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