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Hello all,
I could probably come up with a dozen more tongue in cheek names for this thread and a few would have some bad language in them. I was back to logging in rifles into my Model 1892 survey and you will never guess what I found. Another rifle which I already had, and have photos of, which has the configuration switched out. The rifle was original listed on GB out of Houlton, Maine and was a 44 WCF caliber carbine, no sling ring, and had a 3/4 length magazine. By itself a fairly uncommon configuration but the condition of the rifle was definitely on the low end of collectability. The second time around the rifle now has a full length magazine and BIG surprise… a saddle ring on the left side of the receiver. Really??? There was no photo of the SN in the newest listing but the seller did confirm it is the same SN as the earlier rifle. So then it comes down to comparing photos of the two versions. This can be a bit tricky because of different “photographic” techniques and the different various angles of the photos. I am convinced that the receiver and butt stock are the same to both versions. The barrel may be the same but the front sight blade is different and there certainly has been some “cleaning” in the second offering which makes direct comparison difficult. The rear sights look the same. Both are in poor condition and rusty and the screw slot orientation in both images are identical. Obviously the magazine and that pesky little sling ring are different. The earliest (Maine) listing photos are not bordered and the later (Minnesota) photos are bordered in black. I will try to get the same photos in pairs to load sequentially for easier comparison. The most glaring problem is the doctored wear pattern of the sling ring just does not have the same look and patina as the balance of the receiver.
Left side of Receiver: Compare the position of the dark blotches between the two upper screws which run NE to SW across the receiver. Also note that these two screw slot positions are unchanged while the position of the lower two right screws are different because of the work done to attach the sling stud.
Upper Tang: The forward small sight mounting screw slot orientation is identical while the rear screw has been turned. There are two small indentation in the metal surface between the hammer base and the small screw.
Butt Stock: Notice the crescent shape scratch in the stock wrist just above the end of the lever.
Rear sight: The two screw slots are identically positioned and there seems t o be cleaning at some of the poorest rust spots evident in the early listing photos.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
Michael,
Your spot on. Receiver, Stock and rear sight are the same. The barrel has been cleaned on so I can’t match any rust spots.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
1873man said
Michael,
Your spot on. Receiver, Stock and rear sight are the same. The barrel has been cleaned on so I can’t match any rust spots.
Bob
Bob,
My gut feeling is the barrel is the same and just the magazine was switched. The bluing on the “new” magazine is definitely better than the balance of the rifle. The crazy part is the addition of the sling ring and the fakery of the wear pattern. The original configuration without the ring and the unique short mag is a far more interesting rifle in my opinion.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
Sad. The barrel appears to be the same when looking for it to match–the corrosion scallop to the front and left of the sight (right and down in the photos) suggests it is the same barrel. That saddle ring “wear” is obnoxious.
Too bad these people can’t turn an honest buck instead of ruining good rifles.
Thank you again, Michael, for the heads-up.
Not hard to find, but here’s the link to the current GB auction for anyone interested…http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=495667504
Twobit;
You’ve got this all wrong! It’s not that this rifle was changed from its original configureation, it’s just that this is the way it should have been made by Winchester in the first place!! Right? I’m curious though, was this put up for auction/sale by another “very reputable” party? Food for thought isn’t it?
Apache, Larry N.
Look like this could be his next project. Found it looking through his feedback. http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=484086438
nascar fan said
Look like this could be his next project. Found it looking through his feedback. http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=484086438
Wow! That rifle is in terrible shape. I will keep my eye out for it being relisted.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
Anyone buying junk like that should have his face slapped. It will probably show up later as a mint 44-40 as did the one I almost bought. Big Larry
I received this in an email from the seller this morning at 9:44.
FYI. It was disclosed to the buyer before the purchase that this item was not original, and it was sold with a “money back” return policy. Perhaps you could also let these facts be known in your forum comments.
The auction was scheduled to close at: 9:44:59 on July 23rd.
At 9:24:53 on July 23rd this information was added to the auction page:
The magazine tube has been replaced sometime during this gun’s lifetime and the saddle ring may not be original, therefore I cannot guarantee that this old Winchester is 100% original.
I appreciate his effort in making it known to the buyer of the possibility that he may want to reconsider his purchase based on this information.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
Hey wait a minute guys! This is the new Millennium! Get with it! “New & Improved” – the watchwords!
It’s all in ‘the’ formula…“Something old, something new, something borrowed, touch of cold blue.” Then add a hunkered down pile of Twenty First Century ‘SPIN’!
Still pesky confusion? Likely consult Don Trump, he can put it all straight and that rifle will just seem right as rain!
And… my take
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