I was looking through an old Outer’s book and came across the following gun writer’s response to a query about the power of the .351 SL. In more recent decades, many a gun writer has pronounced the .351 as a fairly worthless cartridge and most have pronounced it not suitable for deer. Earlier opinions seem to differ. Anyway, I found this entertaining:
WINCHESTER AND MAUSER
EDITOR Gun Department: I beg your advice on the following: Is the .351 automatic Winchester powerful enough for bear hunting? Is the 7 m.m. Mauser powerful enough for the same purpose? I am acquainted only with the .303 English army rifle which I carried while a cadet in South Africa. Yours cordially,
J. V. SPEARMAN, D. C.
The Winchester .351 self-loader Is certainly powerful enough for deer or bear, and although it has not the tremendous energy of the long range military cartridges, the difference is partly compensated for by its wonderful speed of fire, and convenient clip magazine reloading system. Many of the .351 self-loaders are in use in the hunting territory of Wisconsin, Michigan and Minnesota. I am in touch with a great many hunters in this vast country and have yet to hear a single adverse report on the 351.
For grizzly bear, moose, caribou or other heavy or dangerous game. I would recommend a more powerful and longer range cartridge such as the .30-40-220, the .30 rimless, Model 1903, the 8 m.m. Mannlicher or Mauser, or the .303 British, in any good reliable hand-functioned arm.
The 7 m.m. is also a good cartridge for large game, but does not lake rank with the .30-40 or the .30 rimless, with the 220 grain bullet. However, if you have one of the 7 m.m. Spanish-Mausers you need not fear to face any game on the American continent with it,— R. A, K.
https://archive.org/details/outersmagazinegunsection/page/526/mode/2up?q=winchester&view=theater
The 351 SL will do anything the 357 Max will do and more besides if the Max comes out of a handgun. Inside 50 to, say, 75 yards, no Texas Whitetail could ignore it nor would it do a hog much good.
I’ve only seen photos of the wild Black bears that once were common here before being poached out during the Depression. Those looked like 150-175 pound animals, 200 being a mighty big one. But I’ve seen several Blacks that live in a state wilderness area Northeast of Seattle that could have topped 400 pounds. Likewise, in the Smoky Mountains National Park, there were a couple of boar Blacks that would have easily topped 300. We now read about Blacks taken in the Carolinas, grown fat on corporate soy bean acreage, that look like second string Grizzlies.
So, neither the old .30 WCF “deer and bear gun” nor a .351 might be ideal for Blacks, at least in some places. As Bert has pointed out, a .401 would be a whole lot better — if you can find one!
The largest [and only] creature I’ve actually seen terminated with a 351 was a big ill-tempered nutria, done in from maybe 30 yards by a friend with an early 1907 I once owned, loaded with vintage Western soft point cartridges. A single round sufficed, which proves little except it did fully penetrate both sides of the fairly thick animal and left a 2-inch exit wound. It was more than a love tap.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
Bullet placement has more to do with stopping power than the size, speed, and/or weight of a bullet/cartridge. World Records have been held with .22s.
http://bear-hunting.com/2022/7/grizzly-with-a-22-c#:~:text=Bella%20Twin%20was%20a%20calm,for%20a%20good%20long%20time.
One of the most favored cartridges used by poachers of elephants in Africa is the 22 Short.
Sincerely,
Maverick
WACA #8783 - Checkout my Reloading Tool Survey!
https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-research-surveys/winchester-reloading-tool-survey/
In Leonard Speckin’s excellent book on The Model 07 he states what the Winchester engineers intent was for the Self Loading cartridges. The .32 WSL was to match the ballistics of the .38-40. The .35 WSL to match the .44-40. The .351 WSL the .40-82, and the .401 WSL the .50-100-450. Of course they also provide a flatter trajectory then the black powder cartridges they were designed to duplicate. I find this interesting.
Bo, so do I..Thanks for sharing.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
Bo Rich said
In Leonard Speckin’s excellent book on The Model 07 he states what the Winchester engineers intent was for the Self Loading cartridges. The .32 WSL was to match the ballistics of the .38-40. The .35 WSL to match the .44-40. The .351 WSL the .40-82, and the .401 WSL the .50-100-450. Of course they also provide a flatter trajectory then the black powder cartridges they were designed to duplicate. I find this interesting.
Yes, very interesting. I’m usually fascinated to learn what the engineers were thinking back then. The specifics of the above information is quite thought-provoking.
Maverick said
Bullet placement has more to do with stopping power than the size, speed, and/or weight of a bullet/cartridge. World Records have been held with .22s.http://bear-hunting.com/2022/7/grizzly-with-a-22-c#:~:text=Bella%20Twin%20was%20a%20calm,for%20a%20good%20long%20time.
One of the most favored cartridges used by poachers of elephants in Africa is the 22 Short.
Sincerely,
Maverick
Yea, Mav but I think I’d rather climb a tree. (I don’t doubt what you say is true but Murphy sometimes takes my first shot for me and leaves the second one to me.)
Carefully placing my SECOND round of .22 Short wherever I’m supposed to put 27 grains of deadliness into a thoroughly outraged, dump-truck sized animal whose complete attention I have just gotten….would probably take more icy resolve than I could muster.
I’d be more likely to achieve a “surprise break” with my anal sphincter than with my trigger finger.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
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