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I sure don’t see a 34 inch barreled M1886 on a daily basis. This one is documented as original. I am curious about other’s opinions on whether it would be better to restore it or not? When we examine a restored piece and comment on whether the rifle would have been better left as it was – we usually don’t know what it looked like before. Here is an example from the opposite direction as we know how it looks in unrestored status.
For this ’86, the rarity of the barrel really trips my trigger and I would enjoy having an example like this. However, the condition is such that I would not want to own it. For me, too much, “eye sore” factor. So – opinions – better left alone or a good candidate for a (quality) restoration?
IMHO: a restored Winchester is no longer an original antique and as such I personally have no interest in it. I’m speaking of the Trumbull type of restorations where the wood is replaced and the metal is filed and sanded down and markings re-stamped after having been re-blued. On the other hand, I’m personally fine with a refurbishing, which to me is cleaning up the years of dirt and oil from the wood, a complete tear-down cleaning of all metal parts, and carding of any rust, but leaving the metal in original condition.
As to the above mentioned rifle, I’d have no problem in owning it in it’s present condition. There must be other’s who think that way, based on the asking price.
"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."
Folks,
In recent years, it seems to me the emphasis on condition has gotten overplayed. Me–I take rarity first, then originality. And this rifle has rarity and apparently originality. I would be glad to have it in its current condition, cleaned up by judicious cleaning with no attempt to enhance its condition. I do think the price is a little steep, but when dealing with rifles of this nature, it can be hard to define a proper price, in my humble opinion.
Tim
November 7, 2015
Offline
I certainly wouldn’t buy it to restore it. It appears to be a hard-used unmolested rifle and at that price I’d hate to diminish it’s value by restoring it.
25, 30yrs. ago I saw a display in Las Vegas, 1886’s in all barrel lengths. I remember his last name was Perry, I asked him how he assembled such a impressive collection, he said he wore out two vehicles chasing around the country buying 86’s. I then asked him which barrel length was the hardest to get, he said 34″! Leroy’s gun looks honest, it would sad if someone restores it. I have watched many collectors restore rare Winchesters only to regret it. If the gun has already been messed with, OK. Guns are made of steel and wood that last forever, people are flesh and blood, you are just a temporary custodian. Just my opinion, temporary custodian of rare Winchesters T/R
Here’s an idea of what restoration does to an old Winchester. This rifle, an 1894 from 1907, was up for sale earlier this year. As best I recall, the asking price I last saw was around $8,000. Don’t recall if it was a straight sale or an auction but think is was a simple sale. The restoration alone some 9 years ago was $12,000. 
"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."
It seems the opinions are all running in one direction. I’m not surprised. It is interesting to read the opinions. I do recall that for Winchesters that could be had with extra long barrels, the 34 inch is less common than the 36 inch barrel. That makes sense to me. If you wanted a really long barrel, I can see most would order the longest possible vs. two inches short of that. By the way, on the topic of a full set of barrel lengths ranging from the shortest to up to 36 inch, I recall many years ago Leroy offered a full set of M1873’s in all barrel lengths (including 34 and 36 inch). I wonder if that set remains together and where it is now? I wonder the same for the full set of 1886’s mentioned. On the topic of that 1886 set, I wonder if it went beyond the standard two inch increments? I ask because over the years, I believe I have seen odd lengths such as 21, 23 and 27 inch 1886’s. That collector could have worn out a third and fourth vehicle tracking those down 
The mans name was James Perry from Laramie Wy. and yes he had odd lengths, nice guy.
Steve,
One more vote for leave it alone (other than a very careful cleaning of the stocks and steel). Once it has been restored, it can never be undone. That stated, I can certainly understand the desire to have a rare Winchester completely and professionally restored, and that rifle would definitely make the list for a high quality restoration. In summary, I am 60/40 on leaving it alone.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
steve004 said
It seems the opinions are all running in one direction. I’m not surprised. It is interesting to read the opinions. I do recall that for Winchesters that could be had with extra long barrels, the 34 inch is less common than the 36 inch barrel. That makes sense to me. If you wanted a really long barrel, I can see most would order the longest possible vs. two inches short of that. By the way, on the topic of a full set of barrel lengths ranging from the shortest to up to 36 inch, I recall many years ago Leroy offered a full set of M1873’s in all barrel lengths (including 34 and 36 inch). I wonder if that set remains together and where it is now? I wonder the same for the full set of 1886’s mentioned. On the topic of that 1886 set, I wonder if it went beyond the standard two inch increments? I ask because over the years, I believe I have seen odd lengths such as 21, 23 and 27 inch 1886’s. That collector could have worn out a third and fourth vehicle tracking those down
While not exactly on topic, I thought this would be a good comparison. Several years ago when I was surveying the Model 1885 ledger records for the caliber survey, I also recorded all of the “extra” length (longer than 30-inch) barrels listed in the ledgers, and this is what I arrived at. It is possible that I may have missed a few, but I feel, that I found at least 99% of the extra length barrels. The total number of records available to survey was serial numbers 1 – 109,999.
| Model 1885 Single Shot Rifle Barrel Length Survey | |||
| Barrel length | No. Surveyed | % of total in survey | % of total production |
| 31” | 4 | 0.124% | 0.004% |
| 32” | 2,216 | 68.820% | 2.015% |
| 33” | 5 | 0.155% | 0.005% |
| 34” | 371 | 11.522% | 0.337% |
| 35” | 1 | 0.031% | 0.001% |
| 36” | 621 | 19.286% | 0.565% |
| 38” | 2 | 0.062% | 0.002% |
| Total | 3,220 | 100% | 2.927% |
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
I’m another for NOT restoring it as you would diminish it’s value in spite of putting A Lot of $$$ into it.
Winchester Model 1873 44-40 circa 1886
Bert –
Fascinating data – thank you.
On the topic of restoration, I would draw some distinctions. The information provided on the ’94 Turnbull restoration was interesting. It highlights a significant distinction for me. That is, I see a large difference between new blue, case color and varnish vs. restocking and new barrel. When that is done, so much of what had been the rifle is simply gone. This is not to say I like new blue, case etc. either.
The other interesting point is one of attitude/philosophy. On one side we have people who believe they own their rifle and they are free on any whim to do what they want with it. On the other side, we have those who feel we don’t own the rifle, rather we are temporary custodians and we should respect the responsibility to care for and preserve it. Personally, I lean toward the latter – as I know many here do.
In the big picture, there is so much out there for sale that a person can find what they like. If you don’t like refinished or restored rifles, it’s easy enough to never buy one. If a rifle is in such poor condition that you not sure it would satisfy you in its present state, buy one in better shape. Rocket science? 
If you have a family gun that will never be sold and its in rough shape, that would be a candidate for restoration but the people who think if I get it restored it will be worth more or people who just want high condition to impress their friends are in for a shock when they finally sell. I own one restored 1873 second model that walked into a local gun show and I recognized that it was restored by Rogers and bought it off the fella for $3500, about what it cost at the time for a restoration. Thats the gun I have no worries displaying over the fireplace while the others are in the safe.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
I’m with most and don’t care for restored guns and would take a gun in not so good condition being in rare configuration. I have a 1886 TD Extra lite in 38-56 that’s not the greatest condition that I’ll keep until I can up grade! That said I think that gun a bit pricey for cond. I was a TIG welder for many years and made repairs on a lot of guns, for a gunsmith friend. Looking at the pics of that 86, there is one of the upper tang that appears to have porosity from a poor welding repair. I would have to pull the stock to check if I’m correct, which would push that price down.
CJ57 said
I’m with most and don’t care for restored guns and would take a gun in not so good condition being in rare configuration. I have a 1886 TD Extra lite in 38-56 that’s not the greatest condition that I’ll keep until I can up grade! That said I think that gun a bit pricey for cond. I was a TIG welder for many years and made repairs on a lot of guns, for a gunsmith friend. Looking at the pics of that 86, there is one of the upper tang that appears to have porosity from a poor welding repair. I would have to pull the stock to check if I’m correct, which would push that price down.
I assume you mean immediately behind the hammer?
On the topic of light weight .38/56 takedown rifles, how does your compare to this one:
http://merzantiques.com/item/w815-winchester-1886-light-weight-takedown
Good eye, CJ57. I saw that but had no idea what it could be. Once you pointed it out it is obvious. Thanx.
"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."
steve004 said
I assume you mean immediately behind the hammer?
On the topic of light weight .38/56 takedown rifles, how does your compare to this one:
http://merzantiques.com/item/w815-winchester-1886-light-weight-takedown
steve004 said
I assume you mean immediately behind the hammer?
On the topic of light weight .38/56 takedown rifles, how does your compare to this one:
http://merzantiques.com/item/w815-winchester-1886-light-weight-takedown
Steve,
yes on behind the hammer. My EL is in about the same condition, but mine has a thinner barrel with sm ramp like the EL 45-70s and SGB. I don’t think Merz’s will letter as EL without that front ramp, maybe light weight
I met the Perry’s in the summer of 1989 at the Allentown PA gun show, they had their awesome collection of 86s on display and they gave me a little booklet on the 86 and their collection, that they made up for the 1989 NRA meeting in ST, Louis. I bought my first 86 a year earlier a 33. I had to have a 45-70 and went though the show a few times and didn’t have much money! I found a standard 26″ rd barrel 60-70% plumbing, the guy had 1500 on it, I had 900 and asked the dealer if he would take it, to my surprise he said he was leaving on his way back to MI and said yes. I was so happy I grabbed it and ran to Mr. Perry and asked him if I did good! Nothing like the gems he had, but he said I did good and it’s a good start! I still have the gun and booklet
CJ57 said
I met the Perry’s in the summer of 1989 at the Allentown PA gun show, they had their awesome collection of 86s on display and they gave me a little booklet on the 86 and their collection, that they made up for the 1989 NRA meeting in ST, Louis. I bought my first 86 a year earlier a 33. I had to have a 45-70 and went though the show a few times and didn’t have much money! I found a standard 26″ rd barrel 60-70% plumbing, the guy had 1500 on it, I had 900 and asked the dealer if he would take it, to my surprise he said he was leaving on his way back to MI and said yes. I was so happy I grabbed it and ran to Mr. Perry and asked him if I did good! Nothing like the gems he had, but he said I did good and it’s a good start! I still have the gun and booklet
That’s a great story!
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