Log In
Members
Home
Add Reply
Add Topic
Offline
I saw this report that was included with a gun listing this am. Serial # applied May 27, 1905 and for some reason it did not arrive in the warehouse until Aug 1, 1906, almost 13 months later. And then it did not leave the warehouse for shipment until Oct 11, 1909, 3 plus years later??? The rifle is not something weird that no one would want in my opinion. Just wonder why it sat around so much. I am aware that sometimes these guns were stamped with a serial # and could sit in the bin for awhile, but why would it sit in the warehouse over 3 years before being shipped? There must be something I’m missing here. Peter
The receivers were serialized many months in advance in some cases. They were serialized long before the rifle was sold or configured. They likely had batches of serialized and/or finished receivers stocked for assembly. This is why there can be such a difference between serialization and received in warehouse.
As far as the 1906 received and 1909 ship dates; I have seen guns sit for a year or more before shipping, no one will ever know why this would be. Another possibility is that the dates were mis-printed on the research form. I have had this on numerous occasions – No fault directed to our wonderful research team (Connie/Jesi; You guys rock and I appreciate everything you do)
Austin\
The receivers were serialized many months in advance in some cases. They were serialized long before the rifle was sold or configured. They likely had batches of serialized and/or finished receivers stocked for assembly. This is why there can be such a difference between serialization and received in warehouse.As far as the 1906 received and 1909 ship dates; I have seen guns sit for a year or more before shipping, no one will ever know why this would be. Another possibility is that the dates were mis-printed on the research form. I have had this on numerous occasions – No fault directed to our wonderful research team (Connie/Jesi; You guys rock and I appreciate everything you do)
It could be that the original person at Winchester recording the dates in the ledger wrote 1909 by mistake, instead of 1906.
Online
Over the many years that I have conducted research in the original Winchester records, I have seen hundreds of similar entries in the ledger books, and I own several Model 1885 rifles with even more pronounced date differentials.
Model 1885 serial number 106383 (in my collection). It is a Plain Sporting Rifle, Take Down, 30 U.S. (30/40 Krag), 30″ round (nickel steel) #3 barrel, plain trigger. Nothing out of the ordinary except that it is a Take Down.
Serialized – December 2, 1907
Received in warehouse – May 15, 1909
Shipped from warehouse – February 23, 1919
It sat in the warehouse for 9-yrs, 9-months, and from the date it was serialized until it sold was 11+ years!
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
tionesta1 said
It could be that the original person at Winchester recording the dates in the ledger wrote 1909 by mistake, instead of 1906.
Possible, but unlikely based on my research.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Bert, I thought that the one I posted with was different…yours, at almost 10 years in the warehouse is amazing to me. I don’t understand that at all. They must have gotten lost or something. Peter
Peter,
My Winchester is just one of at least many hundreds with the same story, and while that may seem like a lot, it really isn’t when you consider there are more than 2-million letterable Winchesters.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
This one sat in the whse. for 5 1/2 years. # 348731. 1/2 oct. 38-55. I guess they were not selling well. One of my favorites. Big Larry
Many years ago, I had a 1886 rifle that arrived in the warehouse 7 years after the frame was serialized. It then sat for 3 years in the warehouse before shipping. It was a deluxe takedown in 33 WCF. The .33 WCF round was not even available when the frame was numbered, that made some suspicious of it. There was no doubt to me that it was correct though.
Hello Peter,
I have looked at a couple hundred thousand Model 1892 ledgers and it is no uncommon to find this sort of occurrence. In addition, I have often seen where a group of 4 to 8 receivers would not enter the warehouse for anywhere from a year to as much as three years after they were serialized. Quite often these rifles have special order features which makes me think that they may have had especially fine finishes and were set aside to be used for fancy rifles which commanded higher prices. These rifle will sometimes have “out of sequence” stamps or proof marks that do not fit their serialization (DOM) date but they are correct for the assembly time period!
The half octagon barrel and half magazine features of the lettered rifle are not a real common occurrence (but far from rare) and Winchester did tend to make rifle configuration in batches which would then be shipped out of the warehouse as orders came in for that type.
I do not have this rifle in my survey. Could you please post a link to the auction listing?
Thanks so much
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
Interesting info Michael , Bert and all. I was unaware that such discrepancies were so common. Here is the link you asked for Michael. Peter
This just points to the many irregularities seen in Winchester’s production that are passed over by amateur collectors who don’t think outside of the box. Winchester was a wealthy company and they obviously did not practice modern inventory control practices. I guess that is just another reason why I like and admire the guns and the people that made them so much.
1 Guest(s)
