January 20, 2023
OfflineI’ve just read the genuine sling furnished with deluxe versions of the models 70, 71, 64, and 52 Sporting was catalogued as the #3260 “carrying strap” although it was a 2 piece leather shooting sling, essentially a narrow (1 inch) version of the 1907 military sling. The keeper loops were fastened together with distinctive blue steel diamond shaped staples, instead of other means. The 3260 sling was entirely without identifying marks.
Roger’s sling keepers are fastened with just such blue diamond-shaped staples. However, the hardware should be brass and the one in question appears to be a white plated metal. There should be a single, parallel embossed line running down the outside edges, and there are.
Two out of three and brass was a strategic metal during WWII. My vote is it’s the original sling of a well-kept rifle.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
January 27, 1992
OfflineI have only actual firsthand knowledge of the Winchester sling that came with my dad’s Model 100 Winchester. I was with him in 1961 when he purchased it. It did have the diamond shaped staples. All information I have acquried since then is from outside sourses and that may or not be correct. More than once I have received incorrect information that I accepted as truth. I was just misinformed, maybe not intentially, but misinformed by someone who believed what they were telling me at that time was true. I assumned, since the keepers were stapled with the diamond shaped staples, it was correct. It may not be original to the rifle, I may have misspoken, as I have no positive way to prove that it is original. I will try to be more careful in the future with my descriptions. Thanks for the information you provided. I am still learning and at the age where my remembering sometimes gets confused.
RDB
January 20, 2023
OfflineWhen we stop learning and lose our thirst for knowledge, the end is drawing near. I think it’s the lack of curiosity that killed the cat; not the other way around.
When my own father lay dying, he had been widowed several years after a 60 year marriage and was ready to leave – he missed my mother terribly.
But he said he wished he could be around to see the new technologies that seemed to be invented daily. He remained curious and inquisitive until he finally lost consciousness.
We are surrounded by two-edged swords. Dad was spared a painful death because of the then new generation of analgesics- oxycontin and oxycodone. Like all such drugs, they’ve done a lot of harm but I’ve seen the good they can do and was grateful. Dad could stay awake and read Popular Mechanics but remain pain free.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
January 8, 2025
OfflineWas shooting my rifles and forgot about the ones I was watching. The 71 went for $1,000. Someone got a deal on a 94 flat band. And someone else got a savage 99 that looked like some sort of a deluxe model. I threw a bid another lot I’m interested in. We’ll see. Going to take the kids fishing, I’m not going to watch it.
January 20, 2023
OfflineAdam, a grand is about what that rifle was worth to a dealer for parts.
Roger, I think both slings – white and yellow -are likely Winchester products. The white one was because the actual maker had it on hand. If it was made up after WWII, strategic metals were hard to come by. Folks were standing in line to buy a refrigerator, much less a car.
I’d guess the white metal is brass plated for some wartime purpose. WRACO was likely not in a position to turn it down. I’d be surprised if it were aluminum.
All this lets me know what to look for if I wanted to put a sling on my 71 or 64. So far, not.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
January 27, 1992
OfflineJust checked both of the sling’s adjusting hooks with a magnet. Both the brass colored hooks and the silver colored hooks are magnetic! That would mean the brass colored hooks were brass plated steel. Perhaps both slings are counterfeit? That may be a possibility. If so, I been dupped again!
RDB
January 8, 2025
OfflineZebulon said
Adam, a grand is about what that rifle was worth to a dealer for parts.
Roger, I think both slings – white and yellow -are likely Winchester products. The white one was because the actual maker had it on hand. If it was made up after WWII, strategic metals were hard to come by. Folks were standing in line to buy a refrigerator, much less a car.
I’d guess the white metal is brass plated for some wartime purpose. WRACO was likely not in a position to turn it down. I’d be surprised if it were aluminum.
All this lets me know what to look for if I wanted to put a sling on my 71 or 64. So far, not.
I have all my grandfathers license plates and the ones during the war years are Masonite or something close.
I wouldn’t spend that much money for a gun I’m going to have to work on. If I can get rifle under 800 or a shotgun under 600, I’m interested. If they need some work, I’m going to learn something. Working on the old guns is just my cathartic hobby.
January 20, 2023
OfflineYes, and you are certainly good at it, from what I can see of the Model 92 and Model 94 you’ve brought back to life.
What you’ve run into with the Model 71 is a facet of Winchester collecting – there are certain icons. The Model 71 and its predecessor, the Model 1886, were not produced in great numbers because they were designed for an Era that was already passing away. However, the originals and the more numerous reproductions made by Miroku and branded as Brownings and now Winchesters, all sell steadily and not cheaply. They are expensive to make, even with CNC machinery, which can only do so much. There’s a lot of steel in an 86 and the 71.
The Model 52 Sporting Rifle and the Model 21 shotgun are likewise iconic, were low production items, and now have a similar price floor.
By comparison to the Winchester Models 97, 12, 90, and especially the 94 and 70, the icon models were made in small numbers, probably because they were so expensive to make and very costly to buy.
For example, a Model 52 Sporting Rifle was by far the most expensive rimfire rifle in the 1957 Gun Digest. It set a man back the same money that would buy a Model 70 Super Grade.
Collectors like the Winchester 63 automatic but check the retail on a brand new one in 1955, compared to a Model 62. The difference would (and did) make many a union machinist or boilermaker, shopping for his boy’s Christmas, pause and think. Production numbers bear this out.
When chasing restorable Winchesters, go for the high production models and leave the icons to the elephants.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
January 20, 2023
Offlinerogertherelic said
Just checked both of the sling’s adjusting hooks with a maganet. Both the brass colored hooks and the silver colored hooks are magnetic! That would mean the brass colored hooks were brass plated steel. Perhaps both slings are counterfeit? That may be a possibility. If so, I been dupped again! RDB
Not likely. If they’re early postwar, who knows. If anybody got duped it was Winchester. But, if we could bring Edwin Pugsley back to life, first words out of his mouth would be, “Winchester was not in the business of selling to collectors.”
WRACO, like everybody else in the business, would have eaten a dead rat sandwich to get raw materials for product to make and sell to the hordes of postwar customers clamoring for manufactured goods.
Brass plated – what’s not to like? Stand aside, please.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
January 27, 1992
OfflineThamks for your post. You never know where a question might lead or what other questions may be brought up and answered.
Somthing else that must be considered, this rifle was made at the height of the Great Depression! Everyone was cutting corners and “just doing what it took to get bye”. RDB
January 20, 2023
OfflineMidwestCrisis said
I didn’t realize the cup of fire I was dealing with. I hope I gave the seasoned collector reading this a chuckle with my 550 max bid. I’m going to keep watching for the $600 model 71. Thanks to this forum I know how to spot a frankenchester.
Speaking as a figurative blade of grass, just remember what happens when the elephants fight.
- Bill
WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist
"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.
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