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Hear are my two short low walls.as per letter
Top .89452
Rifle
32 cal
#1 Barrel weight
Barrel length 20″
Plain Triger
Sights . Carbine rear, Rocky Mountain front
shipped may 29 1901.
**********************************
Bottom 75760
Carbine
44 cal
Barrel weight 15
” The Baby”
shipped with 30 others to F.Lassiter Sydney Australia
The “carbine” is an interesting little 1885. I’ve never seen a Winchester 44A ladder sight mounted on an 1885 before. Looks nice but seems like the carbine has too short of a sight radius for a ladder sight.
"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."
Tony. Wow two great guns, love the shorty ’85’s If you ever decide that those two need to be repatriated back to their country of origin, let me know and I will get you my shipping details. [also interested to know the cal. of your baby]
Wincacher said
The “carbine” is an interesting little 1885. I’ve never seen a Winchester 44A ladder sight mounted on an 1885 before. Looks nice but seems like the carbine has too short of a sight radius for a ladder sight.
The Carbine “ladder” sight was standard on the Model 1885 Lightweight Carbines. Winchester cataloged the “Lightweight Carbine” from 1895 through 1909. They were standard with a 15-inch round barrel, 44 WCF, carbine sights and butt plate, and a saddle ring. A total of (389) of them were made, with (340) of them being 44 WCF. There were (39) made in 32 WCF, (5) in 38 WCF, and (5) in 22 WCF.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Bert H. said
The Carbine “ladder” sight was standard on the Model 1885 Lightweight Carbines. Winchester cataloged the “Lightweight Carbine” from 1895 through 1909. They were standard with a 15-inch round barrel, 44 WCF, carbine sights and butt plate, and a saddle ring. A total of (389) of them were made, with (340) of them being 44 WCF. There were (39) made in 32 WCF, (5) in 38 WCF, and (5) in 22 WCF.
Bert
Thanks for the insight, Bert. Before posting I checked The Sight Book and no reference is made about the 44A being on Single Shots. I couldn’t find anything in either volume of Campbell’s work regarding the 44A and Stroebel only mentions that the 42 Folding Ladder Sight was an option. Regardless, the posted photos sure look like original factory sights.
After reading your informative post I looked in the “Big Book” and, sure enough, there is a picture of a “Lightweight Carbine” and mention that the ladder sight was standard. Interesting that Madis wrote both The Sight Book and The Winchester Book yet this information is only in the Winchester Book and not in the Sight Book.
As an aside, I only use the “Big Book” as a last resort due to it’s lack of a useful index, which makes looking things up a tedious task.
"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."
In addition to the Lightweight Carbines, there were (16) high-wall SRCs made, and they also have the Carbine ladder sight. Further, I have found in the ledger records at least 3-4 dozen standard Model 1885 rifles that letter with “Carbine butt & sights”.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Wincacher said
As an aside, I only use the “Big Book” as a last resort due to it’s lack of a useful index, which makes looking things up a tedious task.
Amen to that! Now if Google would only scan it and post it on Google Books, their search engine would direct you immediately to whatever word or phrase you were looking for.
clarence said
Amen to that! Now if Google would only scan it and post it on Google Books, their search engine would direct you immediately to whatever word or phrase you were looking for.
Great idea! I’ll second that suggestion. (Have often thought something similar was needed, just didn’t think about Google.)
"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."
Wincacher said
Great idea! I’ll second that suggestion. (Have often thought something similar was needed, just didn’t think about Google.)
One minor obstacle to this great idea: convincing whomever now owns the copyright to grant permission to scan it!
cj57 said
Wow! 2 rare gems! What cal. is the carbine? I think most were 44
Yep carbine is a 44
Bert H. said
In addition to the Lightweight Carbines, there were (16) high-wall SRCs made, and they also have the Carbine ladder sight. Further, I have found in the ledger records at least 3-4 dozen standard Model 1885 rifles that letter with “Carbine butt & sights”.
Bert
This may be one of them Bert, carbine rear sight
Tony,
What is the serial number on that high-wall with the carbine rear sight?
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Bert H. said
Tony,
What is the serial number on that high-wall with the carbine rear sight?
Bert
Bert very low number.
#2147
Tony
Tony,
Thanks… I already had it in my survey, and it is one of six identical rifles (shipped to Australia), all with a shotgun butt and “Carb Rear” sight. They shipped on April 7, 1886 on order number 4710.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Bert H. said
Tony,Thanks… I already had it in my survey, and it is one of six identical rifles (shipped to Australia), all with a shotgun butt and “Carb Rear” sight. They shipped on April 7, 1886 on order number 4710.
Bert
Good to know Bert, Ill have to try and locate the other 5.
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