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November 19, 2006
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We’ve seen some extra length 1873’s lately. What they had in common is none of them are currently available. Here’s an interesting one and it is available (it’s not mine). It has several appealing features and they letter. Predictions on how high it will go? Flaws or concerns?
July 31, 2005
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Interesting in that it’s a .44 but has the stepped receiver usually associated with .38, .32 and .22 caliber rifles. The stepped receivers were also used on .44 caliber short rifles. I don’t recall seeing a stepped receiver on a long barrel 1873.
Thoughts?
I call myself a collector as it sounds better than hoarder
January 26, 2011
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In addition to the step receiver, the serial number stamping is what really made me think twice.
~Gary~
November 19, 2006
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pdog72 said
In addition to the step receiver, the serial number stamping is what really made me think twice.
The rifle letters precisely, but yes, a person can’t help but take a pause when gazing at the serial number stamping.
May 2, 2009
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I have seen serial numbers that look kind of wonkie before so I wouldn’t count that against it and the numbers look real. They were hand stamped with individual number stamps. The stepped receiver is odd for a long barrel. The gun was sold in a Poulin Auction in 2018 for $4900.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
December 23, 2012
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I have one with a 30 inch barrel and a set trigger that letters with these features, are these unusual features? terry
July 8, 2012
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I like how he lays it on a piece of granite to take pictures.
June 4, 2017
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tsillik said
I have one with a 30 inch barrel and a set trigger that letters with these features, are these unusual features? terry
Terry, I think the silver monogram plate that letters is an unusual/rare feature. The wood, barrel length, and trigger are desirable features. T/R
May 2, 2009
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The set trigger was the most common special order feature put on a 73. Longer than standard barrels up to 30″ were not rare rare and by themselves didn’t command a big premium. Its when you got to 32″ did the barrel length become rare and the price jumps. When you add several features together did they command more money. I think on this one was the engraved plate that letters is the main draw and the rest is just icing on the cake.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
November 19, 2006
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Bill Hockett said
Interesting in that it’s a .44 but has the stepped receiver usually associated with .38, .32 and .22 caliber rifles. The stepped receivers were also used on .44 caliber short rifles. I don’t recall seeing a stepped receiver on a long barrel 1873.Thoughts?
Bill – by, “long barrel 1873” are you also referring to standard 24 inch barrels? I have to confess I’ve never paid any attention to the stepped receiver as a variable among M1873s. Now that I have it pointed out, I find it interesting.
July 31, 2005
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Steve004,
Correct, I have never seen a Model 1873 in .44 WCF with longer than standard barrel with the stepped receiver. Toward the end of the production run in the 20th century you see all kinds of parts being used up. But this is an early rifle, made in 1883 during the height of Model 1873 production. No shortage of parts then. The stepped receivers match the smaller barrel breech dimension seen on .22, .32, .38 caliber rifles/carbines as well as the short barrel rifles (usually 20 inches or less).
All that being said, this was Winchester and they didn’t waste parts. I suspect that the receiver on this rifle was meant for a .38 caliber gun but got assembled into this special order .44 WCF rifle instead. Essentially, a factory error. Collectors can be a fussy lot, and sometimes something that isn’t “right” will cause them to not buy a particular piece.
See the link to the Winchester Grove 1873 page. Look at all these rifles and check out the ones that have or don’t have the stepped receiver. Not that the regular .44 caliber 20 inch barrel carbines do not have the step. However, the 20 inch short rifle does have it. Why did the Winchester do it that way? I don’t know.
I call myself a collector as it sounds better than hoarder
November 19, 2006
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tionesta1 said
I like how he lays it on a piece of granite to take pictures.
I cringe when I see something like that. I always wonder if it picked up any scratches.
November 19, 2006
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B
Bill Hockett said
Steve004,Correct, I have never seen a Model 1873 in .44 WCF with longer than standard barrel with the stepped receiver. Toward the end of the production run in the 20th century you see all kinds of parts being used up. But this is an early rifle, made in 1883 during the height of Model 1873 production. No shortage of parts then. The stepped receivers match the smaller barrel breech dimension seen on .22, .32, .38 caliber rifles/carbines as well as the short barrel rifles (usually 20 inches or less).
All that being said, this was Winchester and they didn’t waste parts. I suspect that the receiver on this rifle was meant for a .38 caliber gun but got assembled into this special order .44 WCF rifle instead. Essentially, a factory error. Collectors can be a fussy lot, and sometimes something that isn’t “right” will cause them to not buy a particular piece.
See the link to the Winchester Grove 1873 page. Look at all these rifles and check out the ones that have or don’t have the stepped receiver. Not that the regular .44 caliber 20 inch barrel carbines do not have the step. However, the 20 inch short rifle does have it. Why did the Winchester do it that way? I don’t know.
Bill – I enjoyed your observations and comments. I have no idea why Winchester would use a stepped barrel on a .44-40 ’73 short rifle but not a regular rifle or SRC? The rationale is not obvious to me. As I said, I had not paid attention to the stepped barrel variation but it is on my radar screen now. I’ll be looking for it all the time now.
November 19, 2006
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1873man said
I have seen serial numbers that look kind of wonkie before so I wouldn’t count that against it and the numbers look real. They were hand stamped with individual number stamps. The stepped receiver is odd for a long barrel. The gun was sold in a Poulin Auction in 2018 for $4900.Bob
Bob – your comments and information are appreciated. I too, am thinking the serial number stamping is correct. I wonder if it will turn off some bidders? That’s very interesting to know what Poulin sold it for. You and a few others around do a lot of tracking and it benefits the rest of us. Thank you.
May 2, 2009
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Steve,
Here is Winchester’s rationale for the stepped frame as I see it. The 44 has a larger diameter barrel and they made the first 73’s with a given receiver size they figured would be strong enough to withstand the abuse it would get. When they came out with the 38’s and 32’s they were smaller diameter and putting it on a 44 frame affected the looks of the gun with this big lip from the receiver down to the barrel so they made the step receiver.
When it came to short rifles the barrel sizes tend to be a little smaller and there is less force on the receiver because of the shorter arm of the barrel so the stepped receiver was used. The early 44 short rifles and carbines had the full size frames for a time after the 38’s and 32’s had used the stepped but eventually went to the stepped frame. I also had the thought that the later receivers were made with a better steel and could handle the forces with less metal. At the end of production as Bill said anything went as long as it looked like a gun.
Extra heavy guns had a special heavy frame they used to make the receiver strong enough for the extra forces the weight of a heavy barrel also the flats of the barrel didn’t go beyond the receiver. The receiver was taller and wider at the barrel ring area.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
November 19, 2006
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1873man said
Steve,Here is Winchester’s rationale for the stepped frame as I see it. The 44 has a larger diameter barrel and they made the first 73’s with a given receiver size they figured would be strong enough to withstand the abuse it would get. When they came out with the 38’s and 32’s they were smaller diameter and putting it on a 44 frame affected the looks of the gun with this big lip from the receiver down to the barrel so they made the step receiver.
When it came to short rifles the barrel sizes tend to be a little smaller and there is less force on the receiver because of the shorter arm of the barrel so the stepped receiver was used. The early 44 short rifles and carbines had the full size frames for a time after the 38’s and 32’s had used the stepped but eventually went to the stepped frame. I also had the thought that the later receivers were made with a better steel and could handle the forces with less metal. At the end of production as Bill said anything went as long as it looked like a gun.
Extra heavy guns had a special heavy frame they used to make the receiver strong enough for the extra forces the weight of a heavy barrel also the flats of the barrel didn’t go beyond the receiver. The receiver was taller and wider at the barrel ring area.
Bob
Bob – This makes sense. Why do you suppose the .44-40 SRC’s didn’t have the stepped receiver? Has anyone seen an example?
November 19, 2006
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I found a .44-40 SRC with a stepped receiver:
And here is a 24 inch barreled rifle with the stepped receiver:
May 2, 2009
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Steve,
its just like the lack of caliber marking on the 44 when the 38 came out, Its the way we always did it mentality. They dragged their feet figuring the the 44 needed the extra strength but eventually did go to the stepped receiver. There are many of the early carbines without the step out there.
Bob
https://www.merzantiques.com/product/w1066-winchester-second-model-1873-saddle-ring-carbine/
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
July 14, 2016
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1873man said
Steve,Here is Winchester’s rationale for the stepped frame as I see it. The 44 has a larger diameter barrel and they made the first 73’s with a given receiver size they figured would be strong enough to withstand the abuse it would get. When they came out with the 38’s and 32’s they were smaller diameter and putting it on a 44 frame affected the looks of the gun with this big lip from the receiver down to the barrel so they made the step receiver.
When it came to short rifles the barrel sizes tend to be a little smaller and there is less force on the receiver because of the shorter arm of the barrel so the stepped receiver was used. The early 44 short rifles and carbines had the full size frames for a time after the 38’s and 32’s had used the stepped but eventually went to the stepped frame. I also had the thought that the later receivers were made with a better steel and could handle the forces with less metal. At the end of production as Bill said anything went as long as it looked like a gun.
Extra heavy guns had a special heavy frame they used to make the receiver strong enough for the extra forces the weight of a heavy barrel also the flats of the barrel didn’t go beyond the receiver. The receiver was taller and wider at the barrel ring area.
Bob
G’day Bob. Is the heavier receiver frame on the heavy barrel ’73s visible? Do you have any pictures? I have not seen one. Great info!
Chris
A man can never have too many WINCHESTERS...
May 2, 2009
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Chris,
Yes they are if you put the two side by side and look from the top down. What you will see is the flare of the sides in the front is more pronounced. That is how I spotted it. Its not talked about in any book I’ve read. Tonight I can take a picture comparing the two.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
