I walked into my local Cabela’s this evening. I check out their gun library every so often, but it has been awhile cause the librarian or whatever he’s called told me the rifle has been for sale a month or 2 and I haven’t seen it before. They wanted $2299 for it. He said it was a 1950. Sorry I didn’t have my phone with me for pictures. Serial was in the 140k range. The numbers seemed to be stamped bolder than what I’m used to seeing. Is the Fire supposed to be in red? I don’t remember seeing that either. Would that be a sign of a re-finish? The stock was refinished to an oiled look. The bolt looked polished, and any numbers were gone. It was tapped on the rear bridge, and had the mount on it but no scope. No hood on the front sight, only screws where the rear sight would have been. Sling swivels were removed. The recoil pad looked original but was hard and damaged on one edge. Lots of blueing wear on the muzzle. I’m only knowledgable to a basic internet level, but it looked wrong at that price to me. I didn’t think a 375 Pre-64 got that kind of premium. I’ve bought a few guns there over the years, no killer deals, but ok prices every once in a while. They had a good selection of ammo all calibers, but expensive it certainly was. Hornaday $120 a box, Remington over $90 for 375 H&H.
That is exactly how I viewed it. What surprised me some, was the price. I know Cabela’s adds 30% to whatever they paid for it, and you don’t see these too often. I guess they felt it was priced where the market should be. There is always a range where things sell. I brought them a Colt 357 once and they told me what they could give and what their price would be on it in their gun case. I declined it and sold it very quickly to a dealer clear across the country for over 60% more than what they would pay. I kind of think I was under market even at what I got for it, as I haven’t seen another for sale since. Setting a price when their aren’t many to compare with is problematic. I wonder all things considered equal as far as condition goes, does a 375 H&H caliber add to the price? With the price of ammo for it, it would seem unlikely to find a barrel with much wear.
November 5, 2014
Hi Greg-
I don’t pay too much attention to asking/selling prices these days, but my sense is the the 375 H&H Magnum pre-64 Model 70s do bring somewhat of a premium. Like the other chamberings that are “less common” but not “rare”, e.g. 22 Hornet, 220 Swift, 257 Roberts, etc. I think asking price for a “primo” collector condition 1950s standard grade 375 H&H Magnum would be in the $3250-3500 range.
From your description, the gun you were looking at is not a collector gun and is probably overpriced at $2300. But it might attract a buyer if it were in the $1500-1750 range. Someone wanting one for their next African safari or Brown Bear excursion who was going to “fix it up” the way they wanted it anyway. That’s maybe twice what a used/altered 1950s 30-06 standard rifle, e.g. with added recoil pad, etc. would fetch…
FWIW… Winchester did not consistently D&T the bridge of H&H magnum receivers until sometime in 1950, around S/N 160,000. That’s well into Type III (oval tang) receiver production. Their 1950 catalog even says that the M70s are D&T for scope mounts EXCEPT for 300 and 375 H&H Magnum. So added to its list of “faults” MIGHT (???) be non-factory holes in the bridge…
Just my take…
Lou
WACA 9519; Studying Pre-64 Model 70 Winchesters
One thing a 375 H&H has going for it in my opinion over something that is also less common like it, is that there are less comparable rounds available. The 22 Hornet, or the 257 Roberts have so much more competition, and options for something chambered similar that when they lose their collector status, the practical value of the rifle in those chambering’s is not particularly desirable, where the 375 still stands out as an ultra big game round. That sales clerk in Cabela’s also mentioned that whenever they got in a 458 Magnum it would sell immediately…. raising the question why are they in such demand?
November 5, 2014
Greg-
I can’t answer WHY they’re in such demand, but the 375 H&H Magnum can be fun to shoot. Even from a bench… The 300 gr bullet is heavy enough that the recoil, even in an old M70, is just a hard “shove”. Those danged 30 caliber magnums are MUCH less fun IMHO!!!
My Brother is an example of someone who would want a gun like the one at Cabelas if it were priced right… Years ago, he decided he wanted an “Alaska bear rifle”. He got a pre-64 375 H&H Magnum that already had a clumsy wood replacement stock for about $600 (this was a while ago… ). His plan all along was to take just the barreled action (if it shot well – which it did), have it tefloned, put it into a synthetic stock of his choosing, and add optics that cost as much as he had in the gun + stock. Perfect all weather AK Brown Bear or Moose rifle, and even with the mods cost less than a Kimber Talkeetna (I have one of the latter)… It’s fun to shoot too, even though it’s about an 8 lb rifle (with scope)…
We never did the AK bear hunt, but his gun is so easy/fun to shoot that he sometimes carries it here on the farm when looking for 125 lb whitetails!!!
So IMHO there is a market for these “shooters” at the right price…
Lou
WACA 9519; Studying Pre-64 Model 70 Winchesters
Lou,
I’ve not shot one but I’ve read exactly what you are describing about recoil. There are some rifles that for whatever reason have a kick that just hits you wrong. A German 8mm Mauser shot prone gave me a uncomfortable memory of that one. One thing about the 375 is the $5-6 a round adds up.
Greg Mansholt said
There are some rifles that for whatever reason have a kick that just hits you wrong.
I have two such rifles… the first is my father’s 1962 production Remington Model 700 BDL in 7mm Mag. The second is my Single Shot high-wall in 405 WCF. I stopped shooting the 7mm Mag more than 20-years ago, instead favoring my other 7mm (7×57). I still shoot the 405 WCF, but only when I am wearing a padded coat.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Louis Luttrell said
We never did the AK bear hunt, but his gun is so easy/fun to shoot that he sometimes carries it here on the farm when looking for 125 lb whitetails!!!
Elmer would say “that’s just about right.” (But why don’t you spread out some corn or carrots or apples for those starving deer?)
November 5, 2014
Clarence-
You’re too funny sometimes… My Brother (and I) tend to agree with Elmer, although the biggest gun I’ve ever used to shoot a deer here on the farm was a Model 70 338 Win Magnum “Alaskan”…
Regarding not feeding the “poor little starving” buggers… Here in Virginia, “baiting” deer is illegal… That’s one thing.. But just this afternoon I was sitting here in my study and heard a “bump” from just outside… Got up and looked out my window… Not two feet away from my face (no kidding) was a silly little 18 month old wanna-be four-point (eastern count) buck eating clover and trying to snack on new growth on the rose bush just outside the window… In broad daylight… With four dogs in a run not 100 feet away… My wife wanted a “pollinator garden” with “native” flowering plants and I set up a 10’x20’x6′ high fence around it. There’s a reason those “native” plants don’t grow here… Deer find them “tasty” and on a typical morning/evening I can watch them prowl the perimeter of her little fenced space trying to snack on anything that happens to poke through. My Brother’s garden has a 7′ high deer fence around it…
So all in all I think (???) that the “starving deer” around here make out OK… Do you really begrudge me a little bit of venison once a year???
Lou
WACA 9519; Studying Pre-64 Model 70 Winchesters
November 7, 2015
Bert H. said
Greg Mansholt said
There are some rifles that for whatever reason have a kick that just hits you wrong.
I have two such rifles… the first is my father’s 1962 production Remington Model 700 BDL in 7mm Mag. The second is my Single Shot high-wall in 405 WCF. I stopped shooting the 7mm Mag more than 20-years ago, instead favoring my other 7mm (7×57). I still shoot the 405 WCF, but only when I am wearing a padded coat.
Bert
As we get older I understand detached retinas are more likely and more difficult to repair. I have a few “thumpers” in my collection but I’m less inclined to unleash that kind of kinetic energy these days. My right shoulder is marginal due to the aforementioned thumpers and a steady diet of Trap shooting for several years. With the current state of medical care (and my insurance situation) I’ll be leaving those thumpers to you youngsters for the foreseeable future.
Mike
Tedk said
Greg Mansholt said
Lou,
Hunting the small deer here in Western Oregon with a 338 Magnum would likely result in a little venison, maybe very little.
Not if shot in the ribs
Or in the head/neck. I hunted Blacktail deer in western Oregon for many years, and they are not exactly “small” deer (at least not compared to the scrawny Whitetail deer in the southern states). Further, most Blacktail deer are shot and killed at distances < 75-yards.
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
A Blacktail buck can get to respectable size especially when they are living off my shrubs, and apple trees, as I’ve given up on a garden. I can’t chase them off, and when my dog does they are only gone a short time. The does are small, and I don’t think I’ll bother with them unless I’m really hungry. I have a remote cabin in the coast range where I had a doe hanging out under my apple tree up there. It wasn’t afraid of me either, but it wouldn’t quite take an apple from my hand, but it would stretch it’s neck to about a foot from it. I had a ruffled grouse attack my family a number of times at the cabin too. It’s really unnerving when he would grab the back of your hoody and beat you with it’s wings. I grabbed him a number of times as it would come right up to you clucking and mad. After it attacked my dog the next year I haven’t seen it.
I’m a little off topic there, but I don’t think I’d use a 375 H&H on any game in Oregon, or at least from the point of needing it. My cabin has a herd of Elk around it too, and a 30’06 I feel is plenty effective. As you say ranges usually are around 100yds or less due to the undergrowth. Sometimes you can smell them but never see them.
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