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Troutdale, OR
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October 8, 2022 - 5:58 pm
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I used to own this 1892, but traded it off a few years ago.  It’s a desirable configuration, but I just didn’t care much for the lack of condition (particularly on the right side of the receiver).  I came across this 1892 again at the Oregon Arms Collectors show back in August and noticed the same dealer (and also a fellow WACA member!) I had traded it off to had it on his table for sale for a pretty hefty price.  But it was not in the same condition and had some restorative work done to the bluing. I mentioned this to him and he seemed to have no recollection…hmmm.  Now, I see it has changed hands again, with no mention of any restorative work done and the price jacked up even more.  Anyway, buyer beware!!

Here is the rifle currently for sale:

https://www.thewinchestergrove.com/1892/716xxx.htm

 

Here are photos of the same rifle when in my possession:

P1040681.JPGImage EnlargerP1040682.JPGImage EnlargerP1040683.JPGImage EnlargerP1040684.JPGImage EnlargerP1040685.JPGImage EnlargerP1040686.JPGImage EnlargerP1040687.JPGImage EnlargerP1040688.JPGImage EnlargerP1040689.JPGImage EnlargerP1040690.JPGImage EnlargerP1040691.JPGImage EnlargerP1040692.JPGImage EnlargerP1040694.JPGImage EnlargerP1040697.JPGImage EnlargerP1040698.JPGImage EnlargerP1040700.JPGImage EnlargerP1040699.JPGImage Enlarger

 

Don

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Taos NM
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October 8, 2022 - 7:17 pm
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There is a reason none of my 30 Winchesters came from Don……

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October 9, 2022 - 1:23 am
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Don, this doesn’t shock me. I can trace other guns that fit this category. not only him but a couple other high profile names too. Beware!!!!! Frankly I’m tired of this crap, as they have been identified, called on the carpet, and still people buy their stuff and they still have membership to this community. 

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October 9, 2022 - 2:00 am
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What’s most interesting about this “upgrade” is the intelligent restraint.  The bluing on the right rcvr is much improved, yet the blemish on the left side was left visible, & finish wear on the places you’d expect it hasn’t been changed.  Gun looks “right” to me, though “before” photos prove it isn’t!  How was this done?  A complete Turnbull-quality refinish would be a dead give-away, but I wouldn’t be suspicious of this gun.  The matter of ethics aside, considerable artistic skill has been demonstrated in doing just enough to make it look a whole lot better, without letting the cat out of the bag.

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Troutdale, OR
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October 9, 2022 - 2:05 am
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oldcrankyyankee said
Don, this doesn’t shock me. I can trace other guns that fit this category. not only him but a couple other high profile names too. Beware!!!!! Frankly I’m tired of this crap, as they have been identified, called on the carpet, and still people buy their stuff and they still have membership to this community. 

  

In this case, I’m pretty sure Don Grove was an unsuspecting buyer.  It’s the fellow he bought it from that had the restorative work done.

Don

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October 9, 2022 - 2:09 am
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I’m not quite sure why this particular dealer is regarded as a reputable seller???  I’ve noted other firearms they have offered for sale in the past that aren’t quite what they seem to be at first glance.

And so this causes me to not even consider their offerings.

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October 9, 2022 - 2:21 am
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mrcvs said
I’m not quite sure why this particular dealer is regarded as a reputable seller???  I’ve noted other firearms they have offered for sale in the past that aren’t quite what they seem to be at first glance.

And so this causes me to not even consider their offerings.

  

Like this one with a blued butt-plate.  In this serial number range it should be case-colored.  I held this gun in my hands at the same Oregon Arms Collectors show this last August and it is indeed blued. Who knows what else has been done to it?

https://www.thewinchestergrove.com/1894/44xxx.htm

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October 9, 2022 - 4:13 am
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deerhunter said Who knows what else has been done to it?

Finish on the wood, in particular, just looks too good.  (If I knew the man who did it, I might send him some work.)

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October 9, 2022 - 9:54 am
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   A truly rare gun is one that is original. T/R

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October 9, 2022 - 12:11 pm
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TR said
   A truly rare gun is one that is original. T/R

  

That makes me feel good as I probably own a good percentage of rare rifles.  A rifle that has no special features, is not a rare variation or chambering, and is not in high condition – is not likely to have been faked.  There’s just no incentive.  For me, that’s what makes these pieces fun.  I don’t worry I’ve been taken, I can take them to the range, I can carry them in the woods (not on a rainy day) and enjoy them in ways I would never enjoy a safe queen.

Our recent discussion of some Model 1892 .44-40’s got me thinking yesterday about one I let go a couple years ago.  It was a .44-40 with half-round octagon barrel, 2/3 magazine, hard rubber shotgun butt and beautiful figured wood (no pistol grip, checkering or take-down) (it was beyond the letterable range).  The finish was very worn and faded (brown and gray with patches of light freckling on the barrel) but did not show abuse and there were no extra holes or modifications.  You could look at the configuration and wonder why I would let it go.  But, no one would ever say, “how could you ever let a rifle in that condition go?”  But, it was a rifle that likely no one would doubt the originality.  

So, yesterday I was reflecting on that rifle and regretting I let it go.  Then this morning I read TR’s comment.  I MISS THAT RIFLE – it was more rare than I had imagined Cry.  The finish wear was not all negative.  The stories that rifle had to tell…. 

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October 9, 2022 - 12:14 pm
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TR said
   A truly rare gun is one that is original. T/R

  

Yes, but the fact remains that this gun’s appearance has unquestionably been improved from its original cond, which is the reason for its higher price; if not for the “before & after” photos who would suspect the restoration?  Most important question, however, does the restoration work look as good in your hands as it does in the photos?  If it can be detected by close observation, it was a wasted effort (putting aside the fact that many collectors are incapable of close observation), but if not, I say “no harm done.”

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