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Anybody Else Getting Tired of The Lies From Auction Houses??
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November 12, 2013 - 6:03 pm
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Hello,

This Model 1892 is listed in Little John’s upcoming auction in Session III. Supposedly it at one time belonged to John Wayne’s son and is listed as having a 14" factory barrel. The only problem is that the serial number dates to production during late 1914 but the barrel address stamp on the right side of the barrel in their photo did not come into use until 1925. Sure the barrel was most likely produced at the factory but I highly doubt it is original to the rifle.
https://www.proxibid.com/asp/LotDetail.asp?ahid=3161&aid=72716&lid=18084292&title=Winchester-Model-1892-trappers-model-.44-40-caliber-with-factory-14-barrel

And this rare engraved carbine just happens to have the rear sight in backwards! https://www.proxibid.com/asp/LotDetail.asp?ahid=3161&aid=72716&lid=18084323&title=Winchester-Model-1892-special-order-carbine-in-.25-20-caliber-factory-engr And where did they get this detail from??

Model 1892 deluxe’s are rare factory engraved and deluxe engraved carbines are ultra-rare with probably less than 10 known.

Do these people lie because they are just stupid or do they have to work hard at it??

Michael

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Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation

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November 12, 2013 - 9:09 pm
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Here is another one from Little Johns. In there upcoming auction they have a early first model 1 of 1000 serial 6594 with a pistol grip and late checking. It even has a second model lever latch. What get me is they said it all letters except for the shotgun butt, except the records don’t show the pistol grip either for obvious reasons.

Bob

http://www.auctionflex.com/showlot.ap?co=44344&weid=37659&weiid=13460572&lso=lotnumasc&pagenum=3&lang=En

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November 13, 2013 - 2:22 pm
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This sort of thing seems to happen several times in virtually every auction I follow.
Perhaps it’s just the huge numbers at auction, and lots of non-expert employees sorting and writing descriptions.
What’s really sad is when this happens with something like that 1873 with the backwards sight…For $ 150,000 minimum bid, I’d think the details should be presented correctly.
Don
Wink

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November 15, 2013 - 2:47 am
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This stuff does keep us entertained . . . Wink

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November 15, 2013 - 8:08 am
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1873man said
Here is another one from Little Johns. In there upcoming auction they have a early first model 1 of 1000 serial 6594 with a pistol grip and late checking. It even has a second model lever latch. What get me is they said it all letters except for the shotgun butt, except the records don’t show the pistol grip either for obvious reasons.

Bob

http://www.auctionflex.com/showlot.ap?co=44344&weid=37659&weiid=13460572&lso=lotnumasc&pagenum=3&lang=En

[Image Can Not Be Found]

Bob

Very few 1of1000s were ordered with pistol grips and they all letter as such. That style of checkering didn’t start being used until 2nd model serials. The length of pull on the buttstock looks off to me from the standard, hard to tell from photos though. You note it has a 2nd model lever latch. The lever itself looks like a 2nd model level with the front trigger safety ground off the lever.

I find it odd that there are no pictures of the barrel engraving showing the "1of1000" markings to compare with. Also no pictures of the awarded model 94 that was given back in the 1950s search.

Sincerely,
Maverick

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November 15, 2013 - 4:07 pm
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The checkering is the later fine checkering where it should be coarse checkering. You can see the 1 of 1000 engraving in the Ed Lewis book. The gun is in the same configuration since the 1950 movie search so it was modified some time before that.

Bob

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November 18, 2013 - 1:13 pm
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Bob,

Silly me not to look in the Lewis book. After reading it I would have to agree with Dr. Lewis in most regards. There is I think something slightly different that may of happened than mentioned in his writing. Dr. Lewis mentioned that the ledger may have merely omitted the pistol grip and shotgun butt. I think the ledger omits there being a "R&R" return and repair to the gun. The earliest model 73 with Pistol Grip that I have ever come across, read about, seen etc. Is serial #33669 which is the Henry Brown Rifle which is noteworthy of being a rifle that resembles "Engraved like One of One Thousands". This gun was made around 1879.

I think #6594 was Returned and Repaired sometime after 1879. Especially after reading that there is a matching serial numbers on the lever and the inner tang. And having like stock checkering and pistol grip of those seen on 2nd and 3rd model guns.

Also interesting is that the 3rd 1of1000 Model 76 #455 is a pistol grip gun and there are many more 76 1of1000s with pistol grips than 73 1of1000s. And as far as I know, I have never seen a 1st Model 73 with a Pistol Grip. Other than this 1of1000 #6594, and I believe it was sent back at later date. Also 76, #455 was produced in 1877. I think Winchester just didn’t offer pistol grips as a feature until some time after 1877. I think as with many other special order features Winchester was just to overwhelmed to produce them in the early years and which is why they are rare.

Why Little John’s couldn’t simply get someone too state the gun is not as it letters is beyond me? The gun as it sits appears to be all original factory work done on it. I suppose they does this believing that if they did say it wasn’t as letters that it would detract from the value of the gun. Or something to that effect.

Sincerely,
Maverick

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November 25, 2013 - 3:40 pm
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Is there an auction house that you people think is "the best" for Winchesters and similar antiques? Which one? I like just looking at the pictures in their catalogs but if I ever decided to use their services, which one is the best?

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November 27, 2013 - 9:42 am
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Hey fellas…you are missing the point. The more the discription excites the potential buyer…..especially those items that sell at stratospheric prices, the more $$$ the auction house takes to the bank.

Pretty pictures and exciting verbage always draws the unwary away from the tiny critical details…no matter how knowledgable they think they are. Always, always, let the buyer beware; and if it looks, feels, smells and sounds too good………………………………………… !

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