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1894 barrel length
January 3, 2020
1:19 am
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Ct
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jamned said

My serial # is 5782. Number applied August 10, 1895. Shipped from Warehouse Aug. 23, 1895. 32-40, rifle, round barrel, plain trigger. This is all the info given for this rifle. It must have been made some time in 1894, right? Madis book says over 14,000 made the first year.  

I would have to see a pic of the receiver to confirm it’s a first variation model. It may or may not be.

AG

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Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd

January 3, 2020
1:37 am
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Kingston, WA
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AG said

I would have to see a pic of the receiver to confirm it’s a first variation model. It may or may not be.

AG  

The odds of it being a First variation Model 1894 are 99.999% against it.  Of the (213) First variation Model 1894s in my research survey, they are almost all 38-55s (210), with (3) in 30 WCF... No 32-40s.  Additionally, all but (8) of them are below serial number 5300.  My survey covers serial numbers 1 - 7999.

Bert

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January 3, 2020
2:04 am
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Bert H. said

The odds of it being a First variation Model 1894 are 99.999% against it.  Of the (213) First variation Model 1894s in my research survey, they are almost all 38-55s (210), with (3) in 30 WCF... No 32-40s.  Additionally, all but (8) of them are below serial number 5300.  My survey covers serial numbers 1 - 7999.

Bert  

Thanks Bert. Good info for future reference. Not much point in posting a pic really.

AG

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Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd

January 3, 2020
2:59 am
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Chuck said

Madis' info has been proven to have errors.  Use the Resources tab at the top of the page (when was my gun made).  This information comes straight from the Winchester records at the Cody Museum.  The Red book is a great resource.

TXGunNut said
Madis did not have access to the records we use today.
 
Mike  

That may not be true??  

I don’t believe he did, we’ll probably never know. It’s my theory that Madis had access to records we may never see...but I have nothing to base it on other than the stories I read of Winchester purging records and history-minded employees saving them from the landfill or furnace. People like Madis and Houze forgot more about Winchesters than I’ll ever know; I’m just grateful that they shared so much of what they knew. There’s no doubt the PRB has been around for awhile, question is how many people knew about it before Bert Hartman, David Kennedy et al started telling the rest of us about it. I keep dreaming that a shipping log or even a repair shop log will turn up someday. People who know better think that’s pretty funny. Wink

 

Mike

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January 3, 2020
3:57 am
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Thanks guys, the orders are appreciated. 

I don't have any more accessories or equipment, it all sold over the past few months.

Thanks for checking,

Bill

January 3, 2020
4:42 am
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Mike,

There were at least four other Winchester authors who were aware of the PR records before Madis published his DOM booklet... Ned Schwing, Herbert Houze, Dave Riffle, and Roger Rule, as all four published information from the PR records in their respective books. It was the DOM tables they published (which differed greatly from Madis' book) that started me on the quest to unearth their source of information, and during my visits with Dave Kennedy at the CFM (back in 2002 - 2005), I was provided the opportunity to examine the PR records in close detail. It is my belief that Madis was either unaware of the importance of those records, or just was completely unaware of them. He most certainly would have had access to them before they were shipped to Cody in 1976/1977.

Bert

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January 3, 2020
10:39 am
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It may be that Madis had access to any and all records currently available today but elected to use those which best suited his cause.  There may not have been any devious intent, but just perhaps a choice had to be made and an educated guess was made or the records that he preferred were used.

In research, this happens quite frequently.  A hypothesis is formulated and sometimes the results are not cut and dry.  Some findings are lauded and supported while others are discounted or explained in a manner that supports why they were not as expected.

January 3, 2020
2:01 pm
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Blueliner said
I bought Larry Shennum's entire inventory to help him out. I’ve sold all his guns, gear and reloading equipment.

Use eBay. Best for buying and helps me out. Price knocked down to near cost.

Larry is fighting Parkinson’s and is my friend and neighbor. I’ve got many, many books.

Best Offer price is set at $30 with free shipping.

Your support is appreciated !

Bill Coppock

aka: Blueliner  

Bill,

Can you provide a link to your ebay sight where you are selling his books?

Thanks,

Al

January 3, 2020
5:49 pm
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Thanks, Bert. Was hoping you’d clarify things a bit. I have some of Schwing’s books but did not realize he and the other authors you mentioned were not using Madis’ DOM data. I had heard that Houze was aware of the PRB and he certainly had access but I haven’t read enough of his books to know. My theory is Madis had a lot of work invested in his DOM tables and didn’t feel the need to seek other data. I suspect Madis believed he was publishing the most accurate data available at the time. In a book as detailed as Madis’ it’s easy to find a few errors, virtually impossible to write a book of that scope without making a few. The DOM thing is a glaring problem in an otherwise excellent book. Warts and all, I believe Madis’ book has a place on any Winchester collector’s reference shelf. 

 

Mike

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Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe
I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call, Lonesome Dove
Some of my favorite recipes start out with a handful of depleted counterbalance devices.-TXGunNut
Presbyopia be damned, I'm going to shoot this thing! -TXGunNut
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