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Welcome to all you military collectors
December 3, 2017
4:07 pm
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Thanks Bert for this new topic. It should prove interesting for a lot of folks. JWA and I, and others, will do our best to give good and complete information on this subject.    Big Larry

December 3, 2017
6:05 pm
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Larry,

You (and all others) are welcome. In retrospect, I should added this forum a few years ago. It will undoubtedly prove to be enlightening to many of us, myself included. I will look forward to the educational topics to follow.

Bert

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
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December 3, 2017
6:58 pm
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Bert H. said
Larry,
You (and all others) are welcome. In retrospect, I should added this forum a few years ago. It will undoubtedly prove to be enlightening to many of us, myself included. I will look forward to the educational topics to follow.
Bert  

I was a personal friend of Frank Mallory and wrote many articles for him in his magazine. Mr. Campbell was also a friend as was author Peter Senich. Had many contacts with Bruce Canfield and some pics of my stuff appear in his books. All my US stuff is gone now with a few exceptions. I still have some US bayonets and fighting knives and a few deactivated hand grenades which have always fascinated me since I was a kid. Lived aboard Camp Pendleton for 3 years as my Dad was a USMC Master Sgt. Bombs and duds everywhere.   Big Larry

December 3, 2017
7:00 pm
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Thanks for adding this Forum, Bert.  There are several Winchester Military firearms that hopefully will be discussed here including the Model 1897, Model 97, Model 12, and Model 1200 shotguns;  Model 94s (the Spruce Guns and the PCMR carbines), Model 75 training rifles, and Winder Muskets.  Did I leave anything out?  I'm sure I did.

December 3, 2017
8:52 pm
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Tom D said
Thanks for adding this Forum, Bert.  There are several Winchester Military firearms that hopefully will be discussed here including the Model 1897, Model 97, Model 12, and Model 1200 shotguns;  Model 94s (the Spruce Guns and the PCMR carbines), Model 75 training rifles, and Winder Muskets.  Did I leave anything out?  I'm sure I did.  

Don't forget the 1895 military arms.

IMG_0408-1.JPGImage EnlargerIMG_0405-1.JPGImage Enlarger

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December 4, 2017
4:49 am
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Bert,

Thanks for adding this.  It wasn't my intent to push you into creating it but the OP of the other post brought up a good point.  I am sure it will be entertaining as there are a LOT of Winchesters that saw military service, both commercial and military spec'd weapons. 

Some of the standard production Winchester military use rifles I can think of off the top of my head include;

 

Winchester Hotchkiss

Winchester Lee Navy

Winchester 1895/1915 (Russian contract)

1897/97 Riot and Trench Guns

1903 automatic (US-WWI)

Model 87/"C. B. Winder" Muskets (Bert's favorite)

1894 (Spruce Guns, and others)

Model 1912/12 Riot Guns

Model 1907

Pattern '14 .303 bolt action rifles (British)

Pattern '14 Winchester produced bayonets (yes, they are technically Winchester "Arms"/armaments)

Model 1917 .30-06 bolt action rifles (US)

Model 1917 Winchester produced bayonets (yes, they are technically Winchester "Arms"/armaments AND different from the Pattern '14 bayonets)

Model 1918 BAR

M1 Garand

M1 Carbine

Model 75 (WWII USGI Trainer)

Model 67 (WWII British Home Guard)

Model 69 (WWII British Home Guard)

Model 74 (WWII British Home Guard)

Model 69A (C.S.G.)

M14

52B

52C

52D

Model 70 (sniper rifles)

1200/1200 Defender shotgun

1300/1300 Defender shotgun

 

I hope it will be an informative and entertaining addition to the WACA forum.

Best Regards,

WACA Member #6284 - Specializing in Pre-64 Winchester .22 Rimfire

December 4, 2017
7:25 pm
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WOW !!

That list far exceeds my expectations of military qualified firearms.

Thanks for the information !

Bill

December 4, 2017
8:49 pm
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Add the Winchester Hotchkiss to the list.  The earliest bolt action adopted by the US military with both Army and Navy contracts.  This is a rather rough example:

IMG_0669.JPGImage EnlargerIMG_0670.JPGImage Enlarger

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December 4, 2017
9:58 pm
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Mark Douglas said
Add the Winchester Hotchkiss to the list.  The earliest bolt action adopted by the US military with both Army and Navy contracts.  This is a rather rough example:

IMG_0669.JPGImage EnlargerIMG_0670.JPGImage Enlarger  

As most are. Thanks for contributing. Big Larry

December 5, 2017
12:35 am
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Mark Douglas said
Add the Winchester Hotchkiss to the list.  The earliest bolt action adopted by the US military with both Army and Navy contracts.    
   

Good call, I forgot about the Hotchkiss.

I added it to the list.

Best Regards,

WACA Member #6284 - Specializing in Pre-64 Winchester .22 Rimfire

December 5, 2017
1:11 am
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Jeff,

Great job on the list.  I did have to edit it though... the correct Model designation is "87" for the ordnance marked Winder Muskets. 

I also really like the Model 1897/97 Riot and Trench Guns.

Bert

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December 5, 2017
2:33 am
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Yep, you are correct, thanks for fixing my fat fingers.

Regards,

WACA Member #6284 - Specializing in Pre-64 Winchester .22 Rimfire

December 5, 2017
4:31 am
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Bert H. said
Jeff,

Great job on the list.  I did have to edit it though... the correct Model designation is "87" for the ordnance marked Winder Muskets. 

I also really like the Model 1897/97 Riot and Trench Guns.

Bert  

Sometime, I would be honored to show you my WW2 Trenchgun.    Big Larry

December 5, 2017
3:10 pm
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Big Larry said

Sometime, I would be honored to show you my WW2 Trenchgun.    Big Larry  

I would be honored to see & handle it!

Bert

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December 19, 2017
3:01 am
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Have been collecting M1 Carbines for a while now. A fun little rifle to collect and especially shoot. BTW, I see there are more than a few people out west here. The holy grail of M1 Carbines, to me anyway, sit in the Cody Museum in Wyoming. Hope to get out there some day and see the Winchester prototype M1 Carbines in person.

March 22, 2018
11:14 pm
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Big Larry said

As most are. Thanks for contributing. Big Larry  

Here is a picture of my 2nd model carbine.Winchester-Springfield-2nd-Model-Hotchkis-R.JPGImage EnlargerWinchester-Springfield-2nd-Model-Hotchkiss-L.JPGImage Enlarger

March 22, 2018
11:31 pm
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Forgot to post the cleaning rod.Hotchkiss-Cleaning-Rod.jpgImage Enlarger

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November 27, 2018
2:38 pm
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Larry
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Hello all. I had a question on a model 97 Riot. The serial number is 735 say mid 500s dont remember last 3, the first 3 I seem to commit to memory as they are they most useful. I can post the rest if I need, I will dig it out. Im not one who worries about the whole number with xxx I just dont remember. It came from an Ulrich from Winchester the last surviving Winchester Ulrich who were engravers and this amy have been done in the  engraving department not sure, and he states it was a canceled Navy Contract shotgun. I am guessing the 5 or 7 Treaty pact after the war. My question is does anyone know or ever even heard whisper of this? I think it is a fascinating hidden fact if so. It is believed to have been milled out on the side of the receiver left side dead middle 1/4 x 3" approximately

November 27, 2018
9:51 pm
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Larry,

Model 97 serial number 735500 was manufactured in September 1920. At that time Alden Ulrich was the lone engrave in Winchester's Custom Shop.

I am unaware of any "Navy" contract Model 97 Riot guns, or a cancelled contract for them.

Bert

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November 30, 2018
8:44 pm
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There was a 1917 Navy contract for 300 takedown model 1897 riot guns.  But that contract is obviously prior to when 97 riot 735500 was made.

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