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Winchester 69 rebuild or let sit?
April 6, 2016
11:50 am
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April 6, 2016
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I recently acquired a Win model 69 (not 69a) and noticed some inconsistencies on it after lurking on forums for the last few weeks (and after shooting it). It is grouping about 4" above point of aim and 4" right. Holds extremely tight groups however. 

1.) I realized that the rear sight is a model 96 peep sight but the front post has no ramp. I recently purchased the taller front sight to balance out the taller rear peep sight... so someone has changed the sights. Are there any clues as to whether or not this was a target (peep sights with taller front site) or field model (rear blade and short front sight) rifle?

2.) Then looking at the stock there is a cut out opposite the side of the bolt for I imagine a lyman site. Im guessing that its not the orginal stock despite having the correct hardware? Only problem there are no tapped holes for a lyman... there are tapped holes in front and behind the ejection port offset to the left side (looking up the barrel maybe 10:30' o-clock). Any idea what could have been mounted there?

All this leads up to my final question. Given some of the inconsistencies in stock, sights, and tapping should I consider reblueing it? The blueing on it now is streaky and browned. No surface rust or pitting so its in great shape in that respect. The barrel bore looks like new. It is a great, complete, well shooting gun... but is it bubba'd enough that collector value is shot and blueing is no longer an issue since I plan on keeping it?

Thanks in advance and if anyone can tell me how to post pictures I will add them on this thread. Thanks a lot!

April 10, 2016
12:25 pm
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Location: 32000' +
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Hi Mike,

Welcome and sorry for the delay in responding, I have been on the other side of the world for awhile.

1) The Winchester Model 69 was offered with 2 basic sight packages (disregarding the scoped versions); The G6901R was equipped with the 96B peep sight mounted on the receiver with the taller 97A front ramp sight and the G6902R was equipped with the Winchester 32C open sight mounted on the barrel with the shorter 75C front sight.  The "target" version of the Model 69A was not introduced until 1941 (after the 69 was discontinued) so there were no "target" versions of the earlier 69. 

The "clues" to whether is was originally a G6901R or G6902R are simple, if there is a dovetail on the receiver but not on the barrel it is a G6901R, if there is a dovetail on the barrel but not the receiver it is a G6902R. If there are dovetails on both the receiver AND the rear of the barrel it has been modified or is a part clean-up rifle.

The 97A front sight used with the rear 96B was a four piece assembly.  The sight blade was installed in the barrel dovetail and then the sheetmetal ramp was set over it and retained by a clip.  The fourth piece of the sight was a hood.  Many rifles have the hood, clip and ramp missing which just leaves the blade on the barrel which may be what you have?  The 97A sight blade has grooves along the side for the ramp retaining clip and the shorter 75C sight does not have grooves on the sides.

2) None of the early Model 69 versions (pre-69A) were equipped with a side mounted sight.  So your stock is either incorrect or has been modified.  The holes drilled in your receiver sound as if they are for a Weaver side mount scope base.

3) Since it has been drilled/tapped for the scope base it does not have much, if any, collector value so re-bluing it will not affect the overall value by much.  Keep in mind that it will also not "add" value either as it is unlikely you will ever recoup the cost of the bluing job.  So, if a nice shiny blued rifle makes you happy then go for it as you will not be hurting anything with collector value.

Thanks for taking the time to post and ask intelligent questions, many people would just go ahead and modify a rifle without checking to see if there was inherent historical or collector value.  That is why there are fewer and fewer original specimens available every day.  Good luck with your project, the Model 69 is one of my personal favorites.

Regards,

WACA Member #6284 - Specializing in Pre-64 Winchester .22 Rimfire

April 22, 2016
2:42 pm
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Hello,

I also have recently acquired a model 69 and have been trying to find some info on when it was made and possibly the value. I was about to refinish the rifle when I found some info that made me think it may be older than I had realized. However, being that there is no serial number that i can find, placing a mfg year has been difficult.

First, the rifle is a model 69. Everything looks to be original parts.

The safety is the twist knob on the back of the receiver.

The rifle has what appears to be stock peep sights.

Another item that may make a difference is that the takedown screw on the bottom protrudes and is not inset into the stock.( I read that in '37 they made the screw flush to the bottom. This makes me think it was made between 35-37??)

The rifle has dovetail scope mounts on the barrel.

Also, it has the original magazine with it.

Any info would be helpful. There's no sentimental value with this gun, which is why I was considering refinishing it. However, I've always wanted a bolt action, and this is my first(I also received a Marlin 80dl at the same time). Thanks-Justin

April 24, 2016
4:16 pm
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Location: 32000' +
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Hi Justin,

The previously published information about the recessed takedown is confusing.  ALL of the Model 69 rifles except for the last few rifles put in 69A stocks had non-recessed takedown screws.  The recessed takedown screw was introduced with the 69A in 1938 which had the heavier semi-beavertail stock.  As part of the final parts cleanup for the precursor Model 69 some of them were provided with the heavier Model 69A stock.  Originality on these can be determined by the lack of inletting for the safety since the 69 safety was located on the bolt.  The Model 69 (not 69A) was officially discontinued in August of 1939 so your rifle could have been made a bit later than 1937. 

Look at the (WP) proof marks on the barrel and receiver.  Are they on top of the receiver and barrel or on the side of the barrel and receiver above the stock line?  If your rifle has ORIGINAL Winchester scope bases on the barrel it is worth much more than a standard Model 69 and I would not recommend refinishing it. Can you post some pictures of the rifle and bases? We can give you a lot more information to answer your questions if we can actually see it.

If the barrel has been drilled and tapped aftermarket then there is no harm in refinishing as the collector value has already been eradicated.

Regards,

WACA Member #6284 - Specializing in Pre-64 Winchester .22 Rimfire

June 24, 2016
2:18 pm
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Ken Windeler
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I also have a Winchester Model 69 that I picked up a few weeks back. I'm really interested in a 69A but this one was at a local gun store and had an excellent bore and a Lyman 433 Scope in a Mossberg mount on it, so I bought it. Rifle had one serious rust spot which I scraped off, cleaned up and cold blued. Overall condition is good, bluing is typical for an older .22 that was used. It is quite accurate with the Lyman scope when we shot it the first time.

The Winchester was missing the original receiver mounted rear sight which I didn't even notice, but price wise the Lyman scope offset the missing sight. Which brings me to a question: Not knowing any better I bid on a 96A rear sight and one it when I actually needed a 96B. Is there any difference in the sight body other than pointed shape on the 96A and the rounded shorter front on a 96B? 

This 69 has the front sight with ramp base, retaining clip but no hood.

June 24, 2016
4:34 pm
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Ken Windeler said
I also have a Winchester Model 69 that I picked up a few weeks back. I'm really interested in a 69A but this one was at a local gun store and had an excellent bore and a Lyman 433 Scope in a Mossberg mount on it, so I bought it. Rifle had one serious rust spot which I scraped off, cleaned up and cold blued. Overall condition is good, bluing is typical for an older .22 that was used. It is quite accurate with the Lyman scope when we shot it the first time.

The Winchester was missing the original receiver mounted rear sight which I didn't even notice, but price wise the Lyman scope offset the missing sight. Which brings me to a question: Not knowing any better I bid on a 96A rear sight and one it when I actually needed a 96B. Is there any difference in the sight body other than pointed shape on the 96A and the rounded shorter front on a 96B? 

This 69 has the front sight with ramp base, retaining clip but no hood.  

Hi Ken,

As you already noticed, there is no difference between the 96A and the 96B except for the point on the 96A.  You can easily grind/file/sand the point off of a 96A to allow it to fit properly on a Model 69, just match the front profile with the photo of the 96B to get an idea of the finished shape.

96abImage Enlarger

Most shooters prefer the front sight hood to be removed when using the rifle in the field, that is one of the reasons many are missing from used rifles.  If you are looking for an original hood they show up routinely on eBay but are pricey.  If a well made aftermarket hood is all you need then I would contact Joe as he sells a very nice replacement hood that is nearly identical to the original.

Joe Hulett
Apertures-N-More
(231)-943-0653
http://www.aperturesnmore.com
JHulett@chartermi.net

Hope that helps.

Regards,

WACA Member #6284 - Specializing in Pre-64 Winchester .22 Rimfire

June 24, 2016
6:49 pm
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June 24, 2016
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Thanks for the response.

Yes Apertures-N-More. I have an aperture coming from Joe, as the one on my sight has some pliers marks.

Okay then if the sights are the same I'll probably just modify the one I have eventually.

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