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April 15, 2005
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This is getting way out of hand…
Now – https://www.wardscollectibles.com/viewitem.php?item=5179
Before – https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/68/1758/excellent-winchester-model-1906-slide-action-rifle
Now – https://www.wardscollectibles.com/viewitem.php?item=5176
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
May 23, 2009
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So on the 2nd one, Did they just merely matt the barrel? What else changed on it?
Sincerely,
Maverick
WACA #8783 - Checkout my Reloading Tool Survey!
https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-research-surveys/winchester-reloading-tool-survey/
April 15, 2005
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Maverick said
So on the 2nd one, Did they just merely matt the barrel? What else changed on it?Sincerely,
Maverick
Brady,
Did you read both of the auction listings ? Seriously… it was a 22 LR with a Stainless Steel barrel, and it is now a 22 Short with a matted barrel !
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
May 2, 2009
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They changed the barrel from a stainless to a blued steel and the forearm assembly from what I can see.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
May 23, 2009
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Got it!
What I don’t quite get the why such a thing was done to the guns on these two listings. I can see taking a gun from $2500 and making it into a $10,000 gun would make a profitable sense from a fakers point of view. But the last two auctions I don’t see such a practice being profitable. Suppose time will tell.
Sincerely,
Maverick
WACA #8783 - Checkout my Reloading Tool Survey!
https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-research-surveys/winchester-reloading-tool-survey/
May 2, 2009
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Maverick,
Another thing that gets done is someone needs a barrel or wood to upgrade another gun they are keeping and by a donor gun for the parts and then sells the donor gun with replaced parts. Not saying that is what happened here but its another reason you see guns change looks.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
March 31, 2009
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Bert H. said
This is getting way out of hand…Now – https://www.wardscollectibles.com/viewitem.php?item=5179
Before – https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/68/1758/excellent-winchester-model-1906-slide-action-rifle
Now – https://www.wardscollectibles.com/viewitem.php?item=5176
Bert
Bert please send this info to [email protected]. These guys just started selling guns and need to know what is going on.
April 15, 2005
Online
Chuck said
Bert please send this info to [email protected]. These guys just started selling guns and need to know what is going on.
I did, but no response… yet. I highly suspect that both of those rifles came from the same consignor.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
October 29, 2019
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Years ago at a gun show in Anchorage, my brother and I watched a vendor there (low class fellow) swapping sights, forearms, stocks, all kinds of stuff on the Winchesters he was selling. I suppose he was trying to upgrade some to nicer condition or features. We always avoided him like the plague.
Shoot low boys. They're riding Shetland Ponies.
May 2, 2009
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Years ago that was common place with Henry rifles when they weren’t worth as much. A buyer would go to a table and say he wants that gun but with the wood off this other one and the dealers would do it.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
June 4, 2017
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Everyone owns a screwdriver, but the gun is only original once. T/R
March 31, 2009
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Bert H. said
I did, but no response… yet. I highly suspect that both of those rifles came from the same consignor.
Bert
Thanks Bert. Wards has been around for a long time selling gun related items but not guns. Hopefully they will look into this consignor. I feel that they have been honest in the past but may not be up on the firearms?
January 12, 2017
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Like to thank everyone who keeps up with the fake or not original guns and points them out. You doing a good job!
That’s sad. They took the beautiful stock of that first one. Second one the tang and the receiver colors /wear don’t match. It’s vital the auction houses do their part, but caveat emptor. The rarer it is, the more sceptical you must be. I love when someone puts something “rare” or “very rare” on gunbroker and there are two others listed at the same time. Unfortunately old does not equal rare. But sad.
Mike
August 8, 2008
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Might want to forward this whole thread to Wards.
April 15, 2005
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usmc69 said
Might want to forward this whole thread to Wards.
Already been done… they apparently do not care.
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
October 4, 2017
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It’s fraud. Call the police.
July 8, 2016
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Chuck said
Thanks Bert. Wards has been around for a long time selling gun related items but not guns. Hopefully they will look into this consignor. I feel that they have been honest in the past but may not be up on the firearms?
Chuck, As I have stated before, Wards Auctions has been selling guns for a long time and has also been practicing this selling technique for the entire time. You can tell him, send him pictures, send back the guns etc, etc and he simply does not care. He is making a ton of money and that obviously is what it is all about to him. I have no idea where you have come up with “These guys just started selling guns and need to know what is going on” and “Thanks Bert. Wards has been around for a long time selling gun related items but not guns. Hopefully they will look into this consignor. I feel that they have been honest in the past but may not be up on the firearms?” He knows exactly what is going on Chuck! He is not at all innocent as he has been told and shown many times in the past. When are you going to get that??
PS: He does except returns though so his success at this is based on ignorant, uneducated buyers. The guns I bought and sent back were obviously reworked once I got them in hand. Eric is a business man. He doesn’t claim to be an expert on firearms. He puts out there what the consigners give him. In comes the uneducated bidders. Price climbs and gun is sold. Buyer sends money and gets “wonderful” gun. Everybody happy! Since he takes returns, I’m not even sure what he does is illegal, unscrupulous maybe, but not a crime.
March 31, 2009
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Eagle said
Chuck said
Thanks Bert. Wards has been around for a long time selling gun related items but not guns. Hopefully they will look into this consignor. I feel that they have been honest in the past but may not be up on the firearms?
Chuck, As I have stated before, Wards Auctions has been selling guns for a long time and has also been practicing this selling technique for the entire time. You can tell him, send him pictures, send back the guns etc, etc and he simply does not care. He is making a ton of money and that obviously is what it is all about to him. I have no idea where you have come up with “These guys just started selling guns and need to know what is going on” and “Thanks Bert. Wards has been around for a long time selling gun related items but not guns. Hopefully they will look into this consignor. I feel that they have been honest in the past but may not be up on the firearms?” He knows exactly what is going on Chuck! He is not at all innocent as he has been told and shown many times in the past. When are you going to get that??
PS: He does except returns though so his success at this is based on ignorant, uneducated buyers. The guns I bought and sent back were obviously reworked once I got them in hand. Eric is a business man. He doesn’t claim to be an expert on firearms. He puts out there what the consigners give him. In comes the uneducated bidders. Price climbs and gun is sold. Buyer sends money and gets “wonderful” gun. Everybody happy! Since he takes returns, I’m not even sure what he does is illegal, unscrupulous maybe, but not a crime.
As I have stated in many posts I don’t buy guns that I haven’t picked up. I did not know they sold guns when I first posted. I have had good luck with them on other items in the past. Yes you pointed the problems out to me a month ago. I’m sorry to hear that they aren’t what I thought. I just bought 2 cartridges and a box of ammo in the last auction. Again for all that reads this, Don’t buy guns that you have not been able to pick up and look at first…..You will get burned eventually.
November 1, 2013
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Eagle said
PS: He does except returns though so his success at this is based on ignorant, uneducated buyers.
And there are PA-LENTY of them! So many, that they made Jim Goergen, notorious among knowledgeable single-shot collectors for his grossly misleading descriptions in the pre-internet days of buying through Gun List & Shotgun News, a very wealthy man!
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