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model 60A target
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July 24, 2019 - 5:40 pm
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I have inherited my dad’s old 60A target. I used to shoot it when I was a kid 50 years ago.  It has the lyman peep sight with lever, and the ORIGINAL sling.  No finger groove.  The barrel is pretty rusty, and the chrome on the bolt has mostly come off, it still shoots fine. I have not pulled the barrel to see when it was made, but I believe it was between 1934 and 1939. There are two questions:

On the stock, in large stamped numbers are to numbers   13    3       Dad always said it was a training rifle, but for who?  I am wondering what the significance of these numbers is. My recollection of what Dad told me was that it was a training rifle for the military, though I don’t see them using a .22 as a training rifle.

Secondly, would cleaning and re-bluing the barrel and hardware decrease or increase it’s value?  At the least, I think I need to boil the barrel to convert the rust to black iron oxide to reduce the rusting here in the high humidity of east Texas. The bolt would need cleaning and re-chroming.  Assuming that was done as well, and the stock left in the condition it is in, would that increase or decrease it’s value?  And if I chose to re-blue which would be more appropriate for the era, rust blue or chemical blue?

And for not, it is NFS at *any* price.

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July 25, 2019 - 9:56 pm
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First, Welcome to the WACA forum!

Great first post and an excellent rifle! And, sorry that your Dad no longer has your rifle…..mine has passed as well.

They only made a little over 6180 Model 60A Target rifles so tread VERY lightly on any modifications as they are high on the scarce scale.  To put it in perspective, they made MILLIONS of the Model 94 and some of the variations are rare(ish), but the 60A Target was one of the lowest production rim fire rifle models of Winchesters ever produced.

Now, having said that, I will offer my humble opinion as a collector and buyer of the Model 60A Target.  I would MUCH rather have an untouched specimen than retouched, refinished, re-blued, re-chromed or modified rifle and I am sure many collectors would say the same.

The 60A Target had a VERY accurate barrel, similar to the Model 52 of the same period. NONE of the additions you are suggesting will improve the accuracy in any way, nor will it increase the family provenance of the rifle.  The only benefit from a face-lift is to make it look prettier to you, at this particular time, but not only will you never recoup your face-lift investment, you will probably decrease the value of the rifle forever.  Let someone in the FAR future make that mistake, don’t pay the price for them.  Again, just my humble opinion…..

Now, that is the end of my personal opinion.  If you want to move forward with protecting your rifle for future generations, then, by all means, boiling the barrel cannot hurt the value and will potentially assist in halting the rust.  The original barrels were rust blued which utilized the same process.  Do not bother with re-chroming the bolt.  The bolt for a 60, 60A and 60A Target are functionally the same, so if you need a “pretty” bolt you can buy one on eBay for less than the cost of chroming yours and still maintain the originality and history of your heirloom.

There are no records that I am aware of that document any military usage of the 60A Target.  They were produced from about 1930-1939 (not during wartime) and were not part of any training rifle purchase since the military had millions of surplus rifles from WWI and billions of rounds of ammo to practice with.  During the production of the 60A Target it was VERY popular with rifle clubs and shooting ranges because of it’s low cost but superior accuracy so it is most likely that the numbers refer to one of those entities.

I have some of my father’s rifles also and I will offer this, aside from the rust (which should be abated), every dent, ding, scratch, nick abrasion, etc. was put on that rifle by him or myself and I would never think of removing them.  It is your rifle now and I am just supplying food for thought…..but looking at my father’s rifles with the “character” marks reminds me of him every time I shoot them and I would NEVER erase them.

Again, this is my sole opinion, based on my experience……..So, why waste time AND money on what future generations will probably curse you for?  If you are looking to make a quick buck, then by all means “polish” it up to grant the best personal value, BUT, if you are like the rest of us and are intent on preserving history, then oil, it, don’t touch it up and preserve it for your great-grandchildren.

Just my very humble opinion,

Regards,

WACA Life Member #6284 - Specializing in Pre-64 Winchester .22 Rimfire

http://rimfirepublications.com/  

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July 26, 2019 - 2:56 pm
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JWA said
First, Welcome to the WACA forum!

Great first post and an excellent rifle! And, sorry that your Dad no longer has your rifle…..mine has passed as well.

They only made a little over 6180 Model 60A Target rifles so tread VERY lightly on any modifications as they are high on the scarce scale.  To put it in perspective, they made MILLIONS of the Model 94 and some of the variations are rare(ish), but the 60A Target was one of the lowest production rim fire rifle models of Winchesters ever produced.

Now, having said that, I will offer my humble opinion as a collector and buyer of the Model 60A Target.  I would MUCH rather have an untouched specimen than retouched, refinished, re-blued, re-chromed or modified rifle and I am sure many collectors would say the same.

The 60A Target had a VERY accurate barrel, similar to the Model 52 of the same period. NONE of the additions you are suggesting will improve the accuracy in any way, nor will it increase the family provenance of the rifle.  The only benefit from a face-lift is to make it look prettier to you, at this particular time, but not only will you never recoup your face-lift investment, you will probably decrease the value of the rifle forever.  Let someone in the FAR future make that mistake, don’t pay the price for them.  Again, just my humble opinion…..

Now, that is the end of my personal opinion.  If you want to move forward with protecting your rifle for future generations, then, by all means, boiling the barrel cannot hurt the value and will potentially assist in halting the rust.  The original barrels were rust blued which utilized the same process.  Do not bother with re-chroming the bolt.  The bolt for a 60, 60A and 60A Target are functionally the same, so if you need a “pretty” bolt you can buy one on eBay for less than the cost of chroming yours and still maintain the originality and history of your heirloom.

There are no records that I am aware of that document any military usage of the 60A Target.  They were produced from about 1930-1939 (not during wartime) and were not part of any training rifle purchase since the military had millions of surplus rifles from WWI and billions of rounds of ammo to practice with.  During the production of the 60A Target it was VERY popular with rifle clubs and shooting ranges because of it’s low cost but superior accuracy so it is most likely that the numbers refer to one of those entities.

I have some of my father’s rifles also and I will offer this, aside from the rust (which should be abated), every dent, ding, scratch, nick abrasion, etc. was put on that rifle by him or myself and I would never think of removing them.  It is your rifle now and I am just supplying food for thought…..but looking at my father’s rifles with the “character” marks reminds me of him every time I shoot them and I would NEVER erase them.

Again, this is my sole opinion, based on my experience……..So, why waste time AND money on what future generations will probably curse you for?  If you are looking to make a quick buck, then by all means “polish” it up to grant the best personal value, BUT, if you are like the rest of us and are intent on preserving history, then oil, it, don’t touch it up and preserve it for your great-grandchildren.

Just my very humble opinion,

Regards,  

JWA said
First, Welcome to the WACA forum!

Great first post and an excellent rifle! And, sorry that your Dad no longer has your rifle…..mine has passed as well.

They only made a little over 6180 Model 60A Target rifles so tread VERY lightly on any modifications as they are high on the scarce scale.  To put it in perspective, they made MILLIONS of the Model 94 and some of the variations are rare(ish), but the 60A Target was one of the lowest production rim fire rifle models of Winchesters ever produced.

Now, having said that, I will offer my humble opinion as a collector and buyer of the Model 60A Target.  I would MUCH rather have an untouched specimen than retouched, refinished, re-blued, re-chromed or modified rifle and I am sure many collectors would say the same.

The 60A Target had a VERY accurate barrel, similar to the Model 52 of the same period. NONE of the additions you are suggesting will improve the accuracy in any way, nor will it increase the family provenance of the rifle.  The only benefit from a face-lift is to make it look prettier to you, at this particular time, but not only will you never recoup your face-lift investment, you will probably decrease the value of the rifle forever.  Let someone in the FAR future make that mistake, don’t pay the price for them.  Again, just my humble opinion…..

Now, that is the end of my personal opinion.  If you want to move forward with protecting your rifle for future generations, then, by all means, boiling the barrel cannot hurt the value and will potentially assist in halting the rust.  The original barrels were rust blued which utilized the same process. 

That what what I was looking for.  I can do the simple rust blue, and that should not decrease it’s value, since the original bluing was rust bluing.  And the investment is not large for that :).  Thanks for the tip on the bolt.  I will find a bolt for it on ebay.  I feel bad that it got in this condition.  My mom tucked it out of sight under their bed and left it there for years.  Dad never used it much, and when I found it, it has a solid layer of rust on it.

Just for everyones information, I have found an amazing product (that I am not going to use on the rifle, but have used on numerous other things like hammers etc, and that is called     evap-o-rust.  This stuff chelates rust, and does not attack the metal.  One the rust is gone, there is no corroding or etching of the metal…

Do not bother with re-chroming the bolt.  The bolt for a 60, 60A and 60A Target are functionally the same, so if you need a “pretty” bolt you can buy one on eBay for less than the cost of chroming yours and still maintain the originality and history of your heirloom.

There are no records that I am aware of that document any military usage of the 60A Target.  They were produced from about 1930-1939 (not during wartime) and were not part of any training rifle purchase since the military had millions of surplus rifles from WWI and billions of rounds of ammo to practice with.  During the production of the 60A Target it was VERY popular with rifle clubs and shooting ranges because of it’s low cost but superior accuracy so it is most likely that the numbers refer to one of those entities.

I have some of my father’s rifles also and I will offer this, aside from the rust (which should be abated), every dent, ding, scratch, nick abrasion, etc. was put on that rifle by him or myself and I would never think of removing them.  It is your rifle now and I am just supplying food for thought…..but looking at my father’s rifles with the “character” marks reminds me of him every time I shoot them and I would NEVER erase them.

Me either.  And unfortunately I have no kids or grand kids to leave it to.  A few Nephews, to which it would just be my old rifle.  But I do want to stop the rusting and deteriation.

Again, this is my sole opinion, based on my experience……..So, why waste time AND money on what future generations will probably curse you for?  If you are looking to make a quick buck, then by all means “polish” it up to grant the best personal value, BUT, if you are like the rest of us and are intent on preserving history, then oil, it, don’t touch it up and preserve it for your great-grandchildren.

Like I said NFS.   Not wanting to make a fast buck, but would like it to not be so rusted.

Just my very humble opinion,

Regards,  

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July 26, 2019 - 3:24 pm
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Here’s a nice one complete with original Kerr sling. One of my favorite 22’s.   Big Larry

 

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July 26, 2019 - 4:48 pm
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Mine has the original Kerr sling as well, but is *much* rougher….

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July 26, 2019 - 6:09 pm
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[email protected] said
Mine has the original Kerr sling as well, but is *much* rougher….  

The slings are harder to find than the rifles.   Big Larry

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September 25, 2021 - 4:42 pm
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Unfortunately, I lost the rifle to a fire two weeks ago. I have found the barrel with is warped, but no trigger so far. It is ditting in evapo-rust at the moment.

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September 25, 2021 - 10:30 pm
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Here’s another. I am very satisfied with the model 60 target. One of my favorites. Winchester-60a-Target-2.jpgImage Enlarger

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 “There is but one answer to be made to the dynamite bomb and that can best be made by the Winchester rifle.”

Teddy Roosevelt 

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