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Is it possible to determine age of M47?
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March 15, 2024 - 9:55 pm
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I got the two M47 rifles won at auction home and inspected them but could not find any identify marks. I read a post online that these were not serialized. Are there any other markings or means of determining manufacture date on these?

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March 15, 2024 - 10:24 pm
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Shawn,

Take the stock off and check the bottom of the barrel right next to where is screws into the receiver frame for a 2-digit year number.  I do not know if Winchester date stamped the Model 47 barrels, but they did on many of the various models.

Bert

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March 15, 2024 - 11:44 pm
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The Model 47 went through the same changes similar models including the Model 69 experienced so if your barrel is not marked as Bert described it’s possible to determine a likely range of production dates by posting several good photos or consulting JWA’s aforementioned book on the Model 69. The bolt handle change is a helpful clue, there are others. 

 

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March 16, 2024 - 3:56 am
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ShawnN said
I got the two M47 rifles won at auction home and inspected them but could not find any identify marks. I read a post online that these were not serialized. Are there any other markings or means of determining manufacture date on these?

  

Hi ShawnN,

Since they are not serialized and most do not have a date code on the barrel it is only possible to get a rough idea of when a 47 was made (within a year or so).  There were a number of changes, including blued or chrome bolt, smooth or serrated trigger, straight or swept bolt handle, overall length of the stock as well as a few other less obvious changes.  If you start with the details above I can help narrow down the date a bit.  In some cases, the date of change for some of the individual 47 parts differs from the Model 69 so you can’t always apply those dates, even if it is for the same type of change.

Best Regards,

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March 16, 2024 - 12:09 pm
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JWA said

ShawnN said

I got the two M47 rifles won at auction home and inspected them but could not find any identify marks. I read a post online that these were not serialized. Are there any other markings or means of determining manufacture date on these?

  

Hi ShawnN,

Since they are not serialized and most do not have a date code on the barrel it is only possible to get a rough idea of when a 47 was made (within a year or so).  There were a number of changes, including blued or chrome bolt, smooth or serrated trigger, straight or swept bolt handle, overall length of the stock as well as a few other less obvious changes.  If you start with the details above I can help narrow down the date a bit.  In some cases, the date of change for some of the individual 47 parts differs from the Model 69 so you can’t always apply those dates, even if it is for the same type of change.

Best Regards,

  

Thank you for the response. I’ll get them out and take some pictures in better detail and measure the stocks and reply…later after coffee!

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March 16, 2024 - 3:02 pm
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Ok, coffee fix complete! Here are additional pictures of the rifle I’ve been calling “straight bolt”. Actually the bolt protrudes straight out at 90 degrees from the receiver but is angled downward. The trigger is smooth and it has a Lyman peep sight and swivel studs. 

20240316_093218.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093249.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093304.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093315.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093337.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093346.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093413.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093422.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093432.jpgImage Enlarger

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March 16, 2024 - 3:07 pm
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One question I have is regarding the peep sight. I have never used peep sights so I’m curious about how the rear sight fits into its use, if at all. I notice when I sight it, I can see and aim using the rear and front sights thru the peep, but when I sight by centering the tip of the front sight inside the peep aperture the point of aim is higher. This makes me wonder if this was intentional for closer vs distance shooting.

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March 16, 2024 - 3:34 pm
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ShawnN said This makes me wonder if this was intentional for closer vs distance shooting.
  

No, it’s because, as Big Larry said, the peep was added after the gun was bought by someone too ignorant to remove the factory sight.  Leaving the rear sight in place defeats the optical principle of the peep sight, which is that the front bead or post against the target is the ONLY thing the shooter should see, because when aiming, you’re looking through, not at, the aperture.

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March 16, 2024 - 3:45 pm
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clarence said

ShawnN said This makes me wonder if this was intentional for closer vs distance shooting.

  

the peep was added after the gun was bought by someone too ignorant to remove the factory sight.

LOL, that’s kinda what I was thinking but wasn’t sure. I’m going to try it out and see what it does. The M57 I bought at the same auction has a peep with the rear sight still installed but they do not align at all (peep vs rear sight) so no telling where point of impact will be!

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March 16, 2024 - 3:46 pm
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Since it is not original, take the rear sight off and replace it with a blank, then get a Lyman M17A and install it after taking the front sight off. Then you will have a nice target rifle. OR, just take that adjustable sight off and install blank screws in the holes. Big Larry

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March 16, 2024 - 3:59 pm
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Big Larry said
Since it is not original, take the rear sight off and replace it with a blank, then get a Lyman M17A and install it after taking the front sight off. Then you will have a nice target rifle. OR, just take that adjustable sight off and install blank screws in the holes. Big Larry

  

My vision is getting pretty bad. I’m going to try it out along with some other open sight guns. Depending on whether I can see or not, I may wind up adding another tapped hole or two on this gun to mount a scope base. I like the idea of the peep sights better but I want to shoot the gun (target range only) so I’ll have to see how I do. Thanks for your replies Larry.

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March 16, 2024 - 4:34 pm
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ShawnN said
Ok, coffee fix complete! Here are additional pictures of the rifle I’ve been calling “straight bolt”. Actually the bolt protrudes straight out at 90 degrees from the receiver but is angled downward. The trigger is smooth and it has a Lyman peep sight and swivel studs. 

20240316_093218.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093249.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093304.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093315.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093337.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093346.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093413.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093422.jpgImage Enlarger20240316_093432.jpgImage Enlarger

  

Hi Shawn,

Based on the rifle characteristics clearly shown in your great photos your Model 47 is a Type 1d and was made between April 1948 – August 1948.  That is about as close as I can get without having the rifle in-hand and disassembling it.

As Larry and Clarence have mentioned, the peep sight, taller front sight and sling swivels have been added after the rifle left the factory so you have a blank slate to enhance it to suit your needs.

Best Regards,

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March 16, 2024 - 4:44 pm
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Thank you so much for the info Jeff! It still blows my mind that these guns are this old and still in great shape. I’ll post updated pics on the “angled bolt” M47 later. 

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March 16, 2024 - 5:00 pm
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ShawnN said
Thank you so much for the info Jeff! It still blows my mind that these guns are this old and still in great shape. I’ll post updated pics on the “angled bolt” M47 later. 

  

I found a pic of my M47 Target rifle.   Big Larry

 

M47-Target.jpgImage EnlargerM47-Target-2.jpgImage Enlarger

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March 16, 2024 - 5:03 pm
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ShawnN said
Thank you so much for the info Jeff! It still blows my mind that these guns are this old and still in great shape. I’ll post updated pics on the “angled bolt” M47 later. 

  

Hi ShawnN,

I posted a response about your other rifle on the related thread.

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March 16, 2024 - 5:06 pm
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Big Larry said

I found a pic of my M47 Target rifle.   Big Larry

M47-Target.jpgImage EnlargerM47-Target-2.jpgImage Enlarger

Larry’s great rifle is a G4701R Type 3a (made between July 1949 – 1953) Single Shot Bolt Action, .22 S,L & LR, 80A Peep Rear Sight, 97B Front Sight.

There is no such thing as a Model 47 “Target” but with a rifle that nice Larry can call it whatever he wants Wink

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March 16, 2024 - 5:07 pm
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ShawnN said

My vision is getting pretty bad. I’m going to try it out along with some other open sight guns. Depending on whether I can see or not, I may wind up adding another tapped hole or two on this gun to mount a scope base. I like the idea of the peep sights better but I want to shoot the gun (target range only) so I’ll have to see how I do. Thanks for your replies Larry. 

If you’ll dump that useless & primitive rear sight & install a 17A front sight (many on ebay) with an aperture insert for bull’s-eye targets, I think you’ll find you don’t really need a scope for target shooting at the range.  The 17A, or any other globe sight, is not best for hunting or shooting at irregular-shaped objects, but for round targets it’s unbeatable.

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March 16, 2024 - 5:16 pm
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JWA said There is no such thing as a Model 47 “Target” but with a rifle that nice Larry can call it whatever he wants Wink

With those sights & the swivels, “Target” is what the factory should have called it.   “Too nice to shoot” is what it could be called now!

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March 16, 2024 - 6:39 pm
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clarence said

JWA said There is no such thing as a Model 47 “Target” but with a rifle that nice Larry can call it whatever he wants Wink

With those sights & the swivels, “Target” is what the factory should have called it.   “Too nice to shoot” is what it could be called now!

  

+1!! That rifle is awesome Larry! I love the wood on it. 

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March 16, 2024 - 7:28 pm
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ShawnN said

clarence said

JWA said There is no such thing as a Model 47 “Target” but with a rifle that nice Larry can call it whatever he wants Wink

With those sights & the swivels, “Target” is what the factory should have called it.   “Too nice to shoot” is what it could be called now!

  

+1!! That rifle is awesome Larry! I love the wood on it. 

  

2 more of my 4 M47’s. Big Larry

 

Winchester-M47s-2.JPGImage Enlarger

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