Avatar
Please consider registering
Guest
Search
Forum Scope




Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
Register Lost password?
sp_Feed sp_PrintTopic sp_TopicIcon
Faked/Altered Model 61 Rifle Listing
sp_NewTopic Add Topic
Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 31
Member Since:
October 24, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
21
July 28, 2018 - 2:05 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost
sp_ReportPost

Interesting information.  Had somebody measure all lengths from barrel to band, and mag tube and said were correct.  If it was done, it was a long time ago, as the crown on the barrel is perfect and aged like the rest of the gun.  Somebody said, could have been a special order rifle for a child or woman.  No way to know for sure.  Shoots really sweet and since I traded for it, I am not over the top money in it.  I think I gave about $250 trade value years ago.  Thanks for the input!

Andy

Andy Kessner
[email protected]

"A Collector of Winchester Rifles"
Member Winchester Arms Collectors Association-7947
Member of Colt Collectors Association
Member of Cody Firearms Museum

Member Houston Gun Collector Association
Lifetime Member of the NRA
Lifetime Member of Texas State Rifle Association

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 2841
Member Since:
March 20, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
22
July 28, 2018 - 2:18 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost
sp_ReportPost

Andy,

You just gave the proof that the gun is not factory original.  At the time it was manufactured Winchester finished all standard round barrel with a perfectly flat face!  If yours is indeed crowned it was done by someone else.

Michael

Signature-Pic.jpg

 

Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 31
Member Since:
October 24, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
23
July 29, 2018 - 1:21 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost
sp_ReportPost

Ahh, good to know.  Thanks for the heads up.  It appears I have a Franken61.  I’ll give it to my grandson for a shooter..

Andy Kessner
[email protected]

"A Collector of Winchester Rifles"
Member Winchester Arms Collectors Association-7947
Member of Colt Collectors Association
Member of Cody Firearms Museum

Member Houston Gun Collector Association
Lifetime Member of the NRA
Lifetime Member of Texas State Rifle Association

Avatar
Northern edge of the D/FW Metromess
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 3824
Member Since:
November 7, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
24
July 31, 2018 - 2:35 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost
sp_ReportPost

akessner said
Ahh, good to know.  Thanks for the heads up.  It appears I have a Franken61.  I’ll give it to my grandson for a shooter..  

The Cabela’s in Ft Worth has (had?) a very similar rifle. Story is it was cut down many years ago for a woman of short stature, stock was shortened a bit as well. Like yours, very good workmanship. I knew it wasn’t original when I saw it but it looked right.

 

Mike

Life Member TSRA, Endowment Member NRA
BBHC Member, TGCA Member
Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe
I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call, Lonesome Dove
Some of my favorite recipes start out with a handful of depleted counterbalance devices.-TXGunNut
Presbyopia be damned, I'm going to shoot this thing! -TXGunNut
Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 2841
Member Since:
March 20, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
25
November 28, 2018 - 12:41 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost
sp_ReportPost

Hello,

I am adding serial number 77275 and 80472 to the above listing of fake and altered rifles.   SN 77275 was auctioned at RIA in Dec 2017 Lot #364.  Read the description VERY carefully and it references the rifle as “restored” and the “the added custom roll die “WINCHESTER” marking on the left side of the receiver, gallery style loading port”   Who knows if the OB is original or not but the rifle certainly is most likely not original in any manner.   https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/72/364/winchester-model-61-slide-action-rifle

SN 80472 falls into the “highly suspect” category since it was offered on Gunbroker out of Henryetta, OK which is the same seller who was selling many of Charles Key’s known fake guns.  The preverbal walks like and quacks like the n most likely a duck!!!

Michael 

Signature-Pic.jpg

 

Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 2841
Member Since:
March 20, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
26
October 4, 2019 - 5:04 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost
sp_ReportPost

Hello all,

I had the sad job of informing another collector that one of his guns was a fake a few weeks ago.  I added 154602 to the list on page one.  I originally sawa this rifle in 2013 on Gunbroker as a standard rifle sold out of Remlap, AL.  It was purchased in Nov of that year at the Tulsa show from CH Key as a fine looking Long Rifle Only configuration!  

Michael

Signature-Pic.jpg

 

Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 3038
Member Since:
November 19, 2006
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
27
September 26, 2020 - 4:45 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost
sp_ReportPost

akessner said
Interesting information.  Had somebody measure all lengths from barrel to band, and mag tube and said were correct.  If it was done, it was a long time ago, as the crown on the barrel is perfect and aged like the rest of the gun.  Somebody said, could have been a special order rifle for a child or woman.  No way to know for sure.  Shoots really sweet and since I traded for it, I am not over the top money in it.  I think I gave about $250 trade value years ago.  Thanks for the input!

Andy  

This looks like a fun shooter.  The novelty of the short barrel has some additive appeal.  The main thing is no one was ripped off.  You don’t have more than a shooter rifle cost into it.  You’re not going to lose money on it if you sell it.  Actually, (and advertising it as modified) I could see it bringing a couple hundred more than you paid for it on gunbroker.  I say this because of the novelty aspect and also because people will pay high prices for about anything on gunbroker!  

Avatar
GA
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 41
Member Since:
January 1, 2021
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
28
March 2, 2021 - 12:56 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost
sp_ReportPost

Twobit,

  Need to add serial number 103814 to you list if you don’t already have it. The barrel has been shortened by about 2 inches or so, iron sights removed and was drill and taped for scope mounts. I bought this rifle as a shooter and plan to keep it as such. I would how ever like to have the iron sights and a standard length barrel installed.

 

Mike

U.S. Army combat vet,  32 years CCFD Lt. (retired),  NRA Benefactor member,  Marlin Firearms Collector Asso.,  Cody Firearms Museum member - 89213093,  WACA member - 11928,  Griffin Gun Club board member, Hunter, BPCR shooter,  Hand loader,  Bullet Caster

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 2841
Member Since:
March 20, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
29
March 2, 2021 - 8:41 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost
sp_ReportPost

Lt. Mike said
Twobit,

  Need to add serial number 103814 to you list if you don’t already have it. The barrel has been shortened by about 2 inches or so, iron sights removed and was drill and taped for scope mounts. I bought this rifle as a shooter and plan to keep it as such. I would how ever like to have the iron sights and a standard length barrel installed.

 

Mike  

Hello Mike,

I saw that rifle when it was auctions by Belcher Auctions in 2016 and then again when listed by Cabela’s.  Look here for your parts needs:  https://homesteadparts.com/shop/winchester-model-61-c-1_21.html

Thanks

Michael

Signature-Pic.jpg

 

Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation

Avatar
GA
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 41
Member Since:
January 1, 2021
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
30
March 2, 2021 - 10:19 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost
sp_ReportPost

Michael,

  Yes I believe you are correct on the Cabela’s part, the fellow I bought it from said he got it from them. I have a friend that has a basket case 61 that has a fairly good barrel, but I haven’t decided to go there yet. The rifle shoots pretty good as is, I am just not sure I like not having iron sights. I’m old school I guess but I like the option of removing a scope, if I have too, and still be able to use my rifle.

U.S. Army combat vet,  32 years CCFD Lt. (retired),  NRA Benefactor member,  Marlin Firearms Collector Asso.,  Cody Firearms Museum member - 89213093,  WACA member - 11928,  Griffin Gun Club board member, Hunter, BPCR shooter,  Hand loader,  Bullet Caster

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 3
Member Since:
August 7, 2021
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
31
February 12, 2022 - 8:02 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost
sp_ReportPost

Gents,

 

 Old thread …I know. However RIA  caught my eye.

 

 Not only  are some items faked, enhanced , embellished, but often desireable items never get auctioned . The said items are often saved for others, friends , etc. allegedly.

Forum Timezone: UTC 0
Most Users Ever Online: 628
Currently Online: Bill Hockett, clarence, [email protected]
Guest(s) 81
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
1873man: 5158
clarence: 4178
TXGunNut: 3824
Chuck: 3444
steve004: 3038
twobit: 2841
Maverick: 1999
JWA: 1784
Big Larry: 1718
Forum Stats:
Groups: 1
Forums: 16
Topics: 10275
Posts: 88551

 

Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 1400
Members: 11426
Moderators: 3
Admins: 3
Navigation