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Model 64 Deluxe
November 23, 2015
5:40 pm
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West of Fresno, CA
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My Model 64 is missing the sling swivel mount for the front end cap, and I have no idea where to go to find a replacement.  The attached photos show the dovetail cut in the end cap into which the mount attaches.  Any comments will be appreciated.  Thanks, Bruce

http://i966.photobucket.com/albums/ae145/DrBruno/Reno%20Nov%202015%20003_zpsj5ocqsr9.jpgImage Enlarger

http://i966.photobucket.com/albums/ae145/DrBruno/Reno%20Nov%202015%20004_zpsm8jyxj8e.jpgImage Enlarger

Psst, my apologies for the double photos coming from Photobucket.

November 23, 2015
6:51 pm
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Wisconsin
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Bruce,

That is not a original Winchester sling swivel install. Winchester never cut a dovetail into the cap. They were spot faced to make a flat area then drilled.

Bob

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November 23, 2015
11:15 pm
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West of Fresno, CA
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That's interesting (and I'm not doubting you) because I saw three 64s this last weekend in Reno that had this type of dovetail, and that led me to think mine is just missing a standard part.  Whoever Bubba was, he did good work and apparently got around.   I inquired about it with some of the collectors of older Winchesters but they admitted a lack of expertise with "new" rifles.

OKAY, now on to a new question:  Where can I find a cap drilled for (or even having) a sling swivel?  I'd like to make this rifle complete again.

November 24, 2015
12:12 am
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Bruce,

 If you seen 3 other like that makes me wonder if I'm correct on the 64. I looked in the Model 94 book by Renneberg and it shows 2 different styles of a forearm cap sling swivel. The type like I mentioned that is a true swivel were the sling loop can rotate and it shows another type that is a fixed attach point like a modern gun. They don't show how its anchored to the cap so you might have to wait for someone more knowing about the 64's to chime in.

Bob

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November 24, 2015
1:01 am
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West of Fresno, CA
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Bob, I really appreciate your comments.  My visions of last weekend's WACA show already are beginning to blur (LOL).  Out of respect for the nice folks at the show, I didn't want to manhandle the guns to the point of twisting the swivel mountings on their 64s.  They might have turned on their bases (hard to do with slings with old, frayed leather slings attached).  Clarence was awfully nice and took me around to a few nearby collectors to get their opinions but nobody could say for sure.  Afterall, this 64 is a "new" Winchester!  We'll see what Bert H. has to say as I asked him this question at another site.

Thanks again!  Bruce

November 24, 2015
3:05 am
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Bruce,

 

Looks like a nice 64. I've had a few deluxe versions but I don't recall how the swivels were attached. I looked at my circa 1936 Mod. 71 deluxe and the swivel is attached the same as in your picture.

November 24, 2015
4:21 am
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November 24, 2015
4:41 am
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Bruce,

I found this in one of my old catalogs.

Bob

64-cap1.jpgImage Enlarger

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November 24, 2015
6:37 am
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West of Fresno, CA
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Great, I can afford 2 bucks!  Here's a photo from Gun Values Board which I believe shows a mount that fits into a dovetail cut:

http://www.gunvaluesboard.com/value-of-winchester-model-64-.32-special-deluxe-lyman-peep-sight-wanted-28222526.html

I won't bet my life on it but after seeing others like this in Reno, I'm almost sure the swivel mount fits into a dovetailed cut in the end cap much akin to the rear sight on a Model 1911.

Thanks for the compliment, JS!  It's perhaps a 90% gun with regard to blue with wear on some raised edges.  Here are the only photos I've ever taken of the entire rifle which show some of that and abrasion to the buttstock.  Being my only 64, it's just nice enough that it won't bounce around the farm on a pickup seat as do a couple of my early 1950s Model 94s.

BK

http://i966.photobucket.com/albums/ae145/DrBruno/Nov%202015%20002_zpsebuyoa5q.jpg

http://i966.photobucket.com/albums/ae145/DrBruno/Reno%20Nov%202015%20001_zpsje8ydmwo.jpg

November 24, 2015
6:44 am
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West of Fresno, CA
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Final post:  Bert H just contacted me and said the dovetail cut is phony, so the hunt for a new end cap begins!  Thanks to all, Bruce

November 24, 2015
1:35 pm
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 Just wondering if the dovetail cut is phony,could someone have tried to make a standard Model 64 look like a deluxe Model 64?I mean ,why would anyone go to all the trouble of making this phony cut in a Model 64 deluxe that would already have had the correct forend cap installed?

 If there are other Model 64 rifles with this phony cut,could there have been someone at one time that was taking standard Model 64 rifles and making them look like the more expensive Model 64 deluxe rifles?

November 24, 2015
3:19 pm
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Wisconsin
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Bruce,

I would suggest you find a good blued plain cap since its going to be a lot easier to find and have a swivel installed in it. Finding the correct cap with a swivel with a lot of blue will be impossible to find.

Bob

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November 24, 2015
3:46 pm
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I've seen a couple of FE caps like the one on your 64, whoever was making the phoney caps really got around.

So how was the swivel base installed on the ones pictured above, and the catalogue pic that Bob posted?

November 24, 2015
5:26 pm
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Mike,

In that catalog I have it shows a couple of different swivel attachments that could be fitted to the bottom of the barrel. The description said the barrel would have to be inletted to attach the swivel. Perhaps someone got ahold of a bunch of them and installed them on the caps.

Bob

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November 24, 2015
5:29 pm
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West of Fresno, CA
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Mike asked "So how was the swivel base installed on the ones pictured above, and the catalogue pic that Bob posted?"  1873man's catalog pic might depict an endcap and swivel mount milled from one piece of steel.  The dovetailed version looks like it is hammered/tapped in from one side of the dovetail cut just as one would install a rear sight on a Model 1911.  The ones I saw were as snugly/firmly in place as a 1911 rear site.  So far I have seen 1) the dovetailed type and 2) the screw with a hole on the end that simply screws into the endcap. 

ALSO, the checkering work is perfect and smells of Winchester, and thanks to Mike Hunter for seeing a couple similar caps because I was beginning to think I was hallucinating!  BK

November 24, 2015
8:23 pm
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I am going to study this topic further. In my ongoing research survey for the Model 64, I have not specifically noted any nose-caps that were dovetailed for the QD sling buckle. The examples I have access to were milled from a solid piece of steel. However, it seems that a few of you fellows have seen a few, and it warrants a more detailed survey.

Bert

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November 24, 2015
8:38 pm
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Ok Bert,,,,,,,:thumbsup:

It seems that you might want to do the Model 71 also....:confused013:

"I Would Have Rather Lived Through The Industrial Revaluation"

"Instead of The Space Age"

From

 The Twilight Zone

 

November 24, 2015
9:06 pm
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I strongly suspect that they are a factory produced item; I believe that I saw a couple at Tulsa last weekend missing the mount.  The 64s are a little too new for my tastes, so I've not looked much into repairing them

November 24, 2015
9:19 pm
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Does anyone have contact information for Mr. Don Grove, a long time WACA member with a wonderful display at Reno?  As I recall, he had at least one 64 Deluxe with sling attached, and the mount was similar (although complete) as the one I'm referring to.  BK

November 24, 2015
9:22 pm
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Here is his web site.

http://thewinchestergrove.com/

Bob

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