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Can members reply what books(resource material) you use or prefer to use when identifying or researching Winchester firearm facts, particularly model 1894 up to ser# 353,999. I have several books but wondered what the more experienced & knowledgeable collectors use or suggest.
Fortunately a while back I found the excerpt below by Bert H taken from a post in another forum, which clarifies the correct numbers & DOM’s that were referenced incorrectly by many for years & probably still to this day outside this forum.
“As many of you will undoubtedly note, the figures I have compiled below vary significantly from the numbers published by George Madis in his tomes “The Winchester Book” and “The Winchester Handbook”. All of my statistical numbers were derived from a detailed survey (conducted by the Cody Firearms Museum) of the first 353,999 serial number records, and from the Polishing Room Serialization Record Books (held by the Cody Firearms Museum).
For the years 1894 through 1945, the DOMs published by George Madis (and copied/republished by nearly every other reference book or internet website) do not agree with the original surviving factory records (the factory warehouse ledgers and the PRSRB records), and they are inaccurate by nearly four years in the 1896 – 1914 timeframe.
Winchester began producing Model 94s at an accelerated pace starting in 1935. By the end of the year 1935, Madis’ published DOM list and the PRSRB records only differ by just (17) serial numbers (1099625 versus 1099608), but they rapidly begin to diverge in the ensuing years.”
I’m inquiring & asking what book(s) are considered the best reference… to date.
AG
There are many books on Winchesters that have info on the 1894’s. One book to start with is the Winchester Model 94 The First 100 Years – 2nd Edition by Robert Renneberg. There is a Vol 1 too. I don’t know if Vol 2 is just an update of Vol 1?
Chuck said
There are many books on Winchesters that have info on the 1894’s. One book to start with is the Winchester Model 94 The First 100 Years – 2nd Edition by Robert Renneberg. There is a Vol 1 too. I don’t know if Vol 2 is just an update of Vol 1?
Good to hear Chuck, I do have the revised edition.
I also see there’s a newer publication by Renneberg, WINCHESTER MODEL 94: A CENTURY OF CRAFTSMANSHIP.
Hoping someone might reply & comment about this one.
AG
Bob Renneberg’s most recent edition “WINCHESTER MODEL 94: A CENTURY OF CRAFTSMANSHIP” is the best one available thus far. Hopefully, a final version will be forthcoming in the not so distant future.
As I have discovered over the past few decades, the Model 1894 (and its follow-on variations) is a very complex topic, and there is still much to learn about it. That is the primary reason I started the research survey(s) for it nearly 15-years ago. Today, I have more than 23,000 specimens documented in the survey, and I am still averaging 6 new entries in the survey per day. The survey has revealed a lot of interesting details and facts that are not well known or are greatly misunderstood (due to previously published statistical numbers that are erroneous).
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Thank you for the reply Bert. I’m glad to hear WINCHESTER 94: A CENTURY OF CRAFTSMANSHIP is recommended. I will be pursuing that purchase immediately & impatiently wait for the final edition.
And I can’t tell you Bert how many times I’ve referenced your surveys & other publications in the Collector. Appreciated as always.
AG
Keep in mind that the information I have posted/published thus far is only a snap-shot of the survey at the time the question was asked and I posted a response. The survey is a highly dynamic document, and it continually changes as new information is added (though not in any dramatic or significant percentages). As of this evening, the Model 1894/94, 55, 64 research survey contains 22,608 serial numbers in the 353999 – 2600011 range. I have another 393 Model 1894 serial numbers in the 1 – 7999 range. Broken down by model, these are the numbers;
1. Model 1894/94 = 18,721
2. Model 55 = 1,219
3. Model 64 = 2,668
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
“Bob Renneberg’s most recent edition “WINCHESTER MODEL 94: A CENTURY OF CRAFTSMANSHIP” is the best one available thus far.”
Bert is this a revision of the earlier books with added info?
Chuck said
“Bob Renneberg’s most recent edition “WINCHESTER MODEL 94: A CENTURY OF CRAFTSMANSHIP” is the best one available thus far.”Bert is this a revision of the earlier books with added info?
Yes it is.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Thanks Bert. I have Volumes I and II. If there is another one in the works I might just wait awhile. Do I really need 4 books?
Not sure about Bert, but in my world Chuck you can’t have enough Winchester anything. ?
AG
AG said
Not sure about Bert, but in my world Chuck you can’t have enough Winchester anything. ?AG
I agree to some point. I have over 4 dozen books on Winchesters. Do I really need each revision of this book or just the latest one?
Wow fair enough Chuck. I do get where you’re coming from. Looking forward to a Renneberg 1894 “final edition” tho.
I still view the Midas book for photo & option references, not DOM.
AG
I believe the research will go on so there may be more revisions in the future. I was wondering if the current revision has enough new info to warrant a purchase?
Chuck said
I believe the research will go on so there may be more revisions in the future. I was wondering if the current revision has enough new info to warrant a purchase?
Good point Chuck.
The First 100 years was published in 1991.
Winchester Model 94: A Century of Craftsmanship was published in 2009.
18yrs between the two. Probably some new finds illustrated but not sure as well now if it warrants the purchase where I have the revised First 100yrs. Maybe someone else will pipe in who has both & advise.
Definitely will purchase his next & final book.
AG
The second book (edition) titled “Winchester Model 94: A Century of Craftsmanship ” is a significant revision from the first book. If you do not have a copy of it, you should (if you collect the Model 1894/94, or Model 55 and Model 64). To the best of my knowledge, Bob is working on a final edition of the book (which will include information from my research surveys).
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Bert H. said
The second book (edition) titled “Winchester Model 94: A Century of Craftsmanship ” is a significant revision from the first book. If you do not have a copy of it, you should (if you collect the Model 1894/94, or Model 55 and Model 64). To the best of my knowledge, Bob is working on a final edition of the book (which will include information from my research surveys).
Bert
I think you’re right Bert. I’m going to acquire both.
AG
January 26, 2011
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Also, Bob released an electronic addendum a year or two ago that he sold on Gunbroker and offered to us on this forum. I remember purchasing it and downloading the file ……….. not finding it now, but it did have some new discoveries and fun facts that will hopefully be shared in a print version someday. Bob occasionally sneaks on the forum so maybe he will see this and respond.
~Gary~
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