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May 26, 2017
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while surfing around the usual sights, I stumbled on this rifle and thought it was very interesting. My knowledgeable on 94’s isn’t nearly as in depth as I would like, so if this rifle has been seen before or isn’t anything special I apologize.
It just seemed to me to have a bunch of special order features as well as the stamping below the serial number. If rifle is authentic, what is the percentage of 94’s that would have been ordered with a vent rib? Is the return from overseas stamping normally in that location? Why would someone a customer not spring for a customer stock to his dimensions?, ok I’ll stop there and see if anyone else is remotely intrigued. Thanks
April 15, 2005
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Bill,
That rifle is a very long way from being original (or a special order). Winchester did not ever install a Vent Rib on any of their rifle models. In fact, the first factory installed Vent Rib was patented in the year 1919 (for installation on the Model 1912 Shotgun). The serial number on that rifle identifies it as being manufactured in the Fall of 1914.
As for the import marking, the location was/is different depending on “who” imported it. The import marking is a very strong indication that the rifle in question was/is not an authentic “101 Ranch” gun. In my opinion, there is nothing “historic” about that rifle, and it is being falsely advertised.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
November 1, 2013
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Bert H. said
The serial number on that rifle identifies it as being manufactured in the Fall of 1914.
Had barrel markings been moved to the left flat by that date?
Could the purpose of the rib have been aerial shooting, which was one of the main stunts in all wild west shows?
June 26, 2013
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Here’s another from the same seller. I have my opinions already, but wondering what the experts think.
Don
April 15, 2005
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clarence said
Had barrel markings been moved to the left flat by that date?
Yes. Winchester move the barrel markings to the left barrel flat in late 1907.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
May 23, 2009
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Bill Hanzel said
It just seemed to me to have a bunch of special order features as well as the stamping below the serial number. If rifle is authentic, what is the percentage of 94’s that would have been ordered with a vent rib? Is the return from overseas stamping normally in that location? Why would someone a customer not spring for a customer stock to his dimensions?, ok I’ll stop there and see if anyone else is remotely intrigued. Thanks
“If rifle is authentic” Is there a question there or a statement?
“what is the percentage of 94’s that would have been ordered with a vent rib?” – 0.00000000000001%
“Is the return from overseas stamping normally in that location?” Odin International, Ltd., firearms importers and distributors, when they were in business, were located in Alexandria, VA. They operated in the 1970’s and 80’s as I recall. – This is the only reference to the markings I’ve found, who knows if its true. I have know idea how they marked guns for import, but seems oddly done.
Why would someone a customer not spring for a customer stock to his dimensions? EXACTLY! In 1914 I suppose you could still get Winchester to make you a custom stock for any dimension so desired. So more likely someone overseas or in the history of its ownership wanted to customize there rifle with a bit of leather and a screw on rail and sights.
Another interesting detail on the stock.
“MILLER BROTHERS / 101 RANCH PONCA CITY / OT (Oklahoma Territory) / NO 134”. – Why would this gun be marked “Oklahoma Territory”? The rifle was made in 1914, Oklahoma became a state in 1907. I know news would slow back in the day, but seven years slow?
Or perhaps someone could be trying to relish on the popularity of the Miller Brothers 101 Ranch. As they had their own wild west show, and books written about the ranch.
I personally am not to convinced of this rifles’ authenticity.
Sincerely,
Maverick
WACA #8783 - Checkout my Reloading Tool Survey!
https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-research-surveys/winchester-reloading-tool-survey/
June 5, 2015
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With a preponderance of writing there is not one article of authenticity, for either rifle.
Never buy a story.
Vince
Southern Oregon
NRA member
Fraternal Order of Eagles
“There is but one answer to be made to the dynamite bomb and that can best be made by the Winchester rifle.”
Teddy Roosevelt
November 1, 2013
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Maverick said
Or perhaps someone could be trying to relish on the popularity of the Miller Brothers 101 Ranch.
I’d ask my Okie father (who always claimed he’d worked for the 101 as a teenager) for his opinion, except it’s close to 40 yrs too late.
May 26, 2017
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“If rifle is authentic” Is there a question there or a statement?
May 26, 2017
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Sorry that does seem to be both a question and a statement- I really didn’t think it was authentic, but on the chance it was- I was wondering how many others there might be.
December 21, 2006
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Has anyone called this joker out on His”fake” guns as I would dare to say He’s probably aware of the fact they are fakes. I don’t know G.I’s policy on advertising known misrepresented guns or if they even care.
W.A.C.A. life member, Marlin Collectors Assn. charter and life member, C,S.S.A. member and general gun nut.
December 21, 2006
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I did email , then called this feller, Harold Weiser, to enlighten Him on the irregularities of this gun, in a civil manner, giving Him the benefit of the doubt, He muttered something and hung up. I did call Guns International and I believe they are going to cancel that ad.He did email Me back called Me an arrogant $%# hole and threatened Me with his lawyer, good luck with that buddy. Any ways I did call Him out on it, and in My opinion I believe He intentionally set out to dupe someone. I am also very suspect in that “gold” ’73 He’s advertising, however I didn’t mention it.
W.A.C.A. life member, Marlin Collectors Assn. charter and life member, C,S.S.A. member and general gun nut.
Henry Mero said
I did email , then called this feller, Harold Weiser, to enlighten Him on the irregularities of this gun, in a civil manner, giving Him the benefit of the doubt, He muttered something and hung up. I did call Guns International and I believe they are going to cancel that ad.He did email Me back called Me an arrogant $%# hole and threatened Me with his lawyer, good luck with that buddy. Any ways I did call Him out on it, and in My opinion I believe He intentionally set out to dupe someone. I am also very suspect in that “gold” ’73 He’s advertising, however I didn’t mention it.
Good for you Harry. Proper thing.
AG
November 1, 2013
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Henry Mero said
He did email Me back called Me an arrogant $%# hole and threatened Me with his lawyer, good luck with that buddy. Any ways I did call Him out on it, and in My opinion I believe He intentionally set out to dupe someone.
His reaction PROVES it! Had he merely been misinformed about the gun by the consignor, ignorant about Winchesters, etc., no such extreme reaction would have occurred, unless he’s a psycho in addition to being a crook. You did good to challenge his attempted fraud.
December 27, 2007
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Thank you, Henry.
“$%# hole”s aren’t so pretty when the light is directed on their as(s)pects.
You may have saved someone from throwing away money and dreams on this ruse.
November 1, 2013
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FromTheWoods said
You may have saved someone from throwing away money and dreams on this ruse.
True, but anyone who wouldn’t be highly skeptical about all this BS has way more money than brains.
December 21, 2006
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Thanks Guys and yes his reaction would tend to make him suspect. I have made a few mistakes in My day but try to do the right thing if possible. I guess G.I. contacted him ’cause he emailed Me back very Pixxxd of and told Me to f#$% off and several other things . Boy am I upset lol
W.A.C.A. life member, Marlin Collectors Assn. charter and life member, C,S.S.A. member and general gun nut.
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