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California
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May 3, 2014 - 10:20 pm
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What are the Winchester ledgers, what do they contain beyond a " letter " info, and what would an individual page show ? One gun, a series of guns made consecutively ? How can a member access one containing and individual S/N ?
Who has them ?

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May 3, 2014 - 10:50 pm
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The Winchester "ledgers" are the record books that were kept in the receiving warehouse. The do not contain a "letter". Instead, the information in the ledger book records is used to create a factory "letter".

The Cody Firearms Museum records office at the Buffalo Bill Historical Museum has possession and control of the records.

Each page contain 50 consecutive serial numbers, and all of the information that was originally recorded for those serial numbers. At a minimum, the ledger entry contains the following;

1. Date received in the warehouse
2. Type (e.g. Rifle, Carbine, or Musket)
3. Caliber/cartridge
4. Barrel (e.g. Octagon, Round, or 1/2 Octagon)
5. Trigger (plain or set)
6. Stocks, sights, and any special order features
7. Date shipped (sold)
8. Work order number.

As mentioned, the museum has possession of the records. If you visit the museum, you can go to the McCracken research library and search the records (by appointment), or you can go to the records office and ask them to check the records. If you are a CFM member, you can call or email the records office and have a serial number researched.

For more information, use this link – http://centerofthewest.org/explore/firearms/firearms-records/

Bert

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
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May 4, 2014 - 4:11 pm
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Thanks, Bert,
What about the following part of the question:

" what do they contain beyond a " letter " info, and what would an individual page show ? One gun, a series of guns made consecutively ? "

Is there anything on a ledger beyond the letter info that would help the collector ?

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"road king"
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May 4, 2014 - 5:06 pm
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Here is a link you can look at a copy of the Cody Letter and copy of the ledger. There are a series of photos of the gun and the bottom two photos show the letter and ledger. Click on each of these photos and the photo will enlarge.

http://www.rarewinchesters.com/gunroom/1886/M86-128712/details.shtml

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May 4, 2014 - 5:16 pm
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Hey Road King you beat me to it.

"I Would Have Rather Lived Through The Industrial Revaluation"

"Instead of The Space Age"

From

 The Twilight Zone

 

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May 4, 2014 - 6:34 pm
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Road King,

Much appreciated……you had to have great set of eyes to work in that department ❗

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"road king"
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May 4, 2014 - 7:04 pm
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Once you see the ledgers you can appreciate the work the girls at Cody have to do to produce a letter. 🙂

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May 4, 2014 - 9:37 pm
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blueliner said
Thanks, Bert,
What about the following part of the question:

"what do they contain beyond a " letter " info, and what would an individual page show ? One gun, a series of guns made consecutively ? "

Is there anything on a ledger beyond the letter info that would help the collector ?

I do not know how I could have stated it to you any clearer than I did in my first response ❓

In answer to your repeated question

"what do they contain beyond a " letter "

The records contain exactly what you see on the letter… nothing more, and nothing less.

Is there anything on a ledger beyond the letter info that would help the collector ?

No, nothing.

and what would an individual page show ? One gun, a series of guns made consecutively ?

Again (and I will repeat myself), each page contains 50 consecutive serial numbers, and all of the information that was originally recorded for those serial numbers. At a minimum, the ledger entry contains the following;

1. Date received in the warehouse
2. Type (e.g. Rifle, Carbine, or Musket)
3. Caliber/cartridge
4. Barrel (e.g. Octagon, Round, or 1/2 Octagon)
5. Trigger (plain or set)
6. Special or stocks, sights, and any other special order features
7. Date shipped (sold)
8. Work order number.

Just to make it very clear… if it isn’t on the CFM letter, it is not in the records.

Bert

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
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