Avatar

Please consider registering
guest

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —






— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters




sp_Feed Topic RSS sp_Print sp_TopicIcon
1894 22” short rifle made in 1908
January 24, 2021
12:00 am
Avatar
California
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 447
Member Since:
July 19, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

What would have been the standard sight combination for a 1894 22” short rifle 30 cal. made in 1908 ?  I see different sight models in the Madis book and the Old Gunsights by Stroebel ?

Thanks,

Bill

January 24, 2021
4:48 am
Avatar
Kingston, WA
Forum Posts: 11852
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Bill,

What is the distance from the center of the sight dovetail to the front face of the receiver frame?

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

January 24, 2021
4:39 pm
Avatar
California
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 447
Member Since:
July 19, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Bert,

20 3/8 “ barrel distance. Also 8 3/8” forearm.

Marbles Sheard  front sight

Rear sight not sure of. Not a Rocky Mountain, but similar with slightly more opening. 26b ? PAT FEB 22 ‘27 marked on rear sight front. Missing elevator. Any idea of type ?

January 24, 2021
5:25 pm
Avatar
California
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 447
Member Since:
July 19, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Bert H. said
Bill,
What is the distance from the center of the sight dovetail to the front face of the receiver frame?  

Bert,

20 3/8 “ barrel distance. Also 8 3/8” forearm.

Marbles Sheard  front sight

Rear sight not sure of. Not a Rocky Mountain, but similar with slightly more opening. 26b ? PAT FEB 22 ‘27 marked on rear sight front. Missing elevator. Any idea of type ?

January 24, 2021
5:41 pm
Avatar
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1039
Member Since:
June 4, 2017
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online

 Bill, I think Bert was referring to the rear dove tail with the measurement. T/R

January 24, 2021
5:43 pm
Avatar
California
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 447
Member Since:
July 19, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Thanks T/R

January 24, 2021
6:20 pm
Avatar
Kingston, WA
Forum Posts: 11852
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

TR said
 Bill, I think Bert was referring to the rear dove tail with the measurement. T/R  

Yes, that is exactly what I was asking for.

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

January 24, 2021
6:26 pm
Avatar
Kingston, WA
Forum Posts: 11852
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Blueliner said
Bert,

20 3/8 “ barrel distance. Also 8 3/8” forearm.

Marbles Sheard  front sight

Rear sight not sure of. Not a Rocky Mountain, but similar with slightly more opening. 26b ? PAT FEB 22 ‘27 marked on rear sight front. Missing elevator. Any idea of type ?  

Bill,

The rear sight you mention is a 22-series sight, and is not correct for a 1908 production short rifle.  Many of the Short rifles have  slightly reduced distance from the receiver to the rear sight dovetail, and were often fitted with the 3-leaf express sight.  If the rear sight dovetail is in the same location as found on the 26-inch barreled Model 1894 rifles, they I would expect to find a 26-series sight installed.

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

January 24, 2021
6:55 pm
Avatar
Troutdale, OR
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1177
Member Since:
June 26, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
January 24, 2021
7:29 pm
Avatar
California
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 447
Member Since:
July 19, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Bert & Deerhunter,

Yes, that’s the short rifle. Rear sight center of dovetail to receiver front is 3 15/16. I’m relatively sure it was not an original rear sight, and is missing the elevator. It’s been on the rifle for quite awhile. Markings on the barrel would indicate an extension from the sight by the elevator. The front Marbles Sheard looks very old and may be original.  I’m wondering what the original rear sight was. Based on the front sight, if original, the rear may have been a Marbles, but could have been a Winchester, according to the Madis & Stroebel books.  A lots of combinations there !

What are the likely rear sight possibilities ?

Bill

January 24, 2021
7:46 pm
Avatar
Kingston, WA
Forum Posts: 11852
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Bill,

The most likely sight was a Winchester 3-leaf express. They are frequently found with one or both of the folding leafs broken, which motivates someone to replace the sight.

Bert

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

January 25, 2021
2:59 am
Avatar
California
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 447
Member Since:
July 19, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Thanks, Bert

The probability of finding a 3 leaf is low and price would be high.

Rather than find a replacement elevator for what’s on the rifle, what Winchester sight would be a good addition to this 1908 short rifle to match up with the Marbles Sheard blade sight ? This is understanding the center of dovetail to receiver is 3 15/16”

I’d like to get a good match-up for shooting accuracy.

Bill 

January 25, 2021
3:54 am
Avatar
Kingston, WA
Forum Posts: 11852
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Bill,

The only sight that is going to fit the short dovetail slot location is a 3-leaf express.  

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

January 25, 2021
4:08 am
Avatar
California
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 447
Member Since:
July 19, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Thanks for hanging in there Bert !

I’ll start an ongoing search, and maybe someone will come up with one after this posting.

Bill

January 25, 2021
4:15 am
Avatar
Troutdale, OR
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1177
Member Since:
June 26, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Looking at the photos it looks like the rifle would accommodate a variety of standard length rear sights.  Not just the 3-leaf express sight.

January 25, 2021
6:34 pm
Avatar
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 2809
Member Since:
March 31, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Bill, get a new elevator and you’ll be fine.  Looking at the wear pattern I can not tell if the earlier one will fit best or the post 1900 elevators with the thumb piece on the rear?

January 26, 2021
12:03 am
Avatar
California
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 447
Member Since:
July 19, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Chuck,

Probably an elevator with PAT. 1901 was on there.

What Bert has pointed out is the dovetails are 1/2” different on pre & post 1900 by 1/2”. Thus the 3 leaf was intended for the 4” dovetail to receiver distance.

I’ll bring the rifle and my 1895 made 22” rifle to show you at LJ some Saturday.

My goal is to get the original sights on it, which also means replacing the Marbles front sight too.

Meanwhile, I’ll get an elevator from Dr. Winchester  and return it for another if it doesn’t fit.

Forum Timezone: UTC 0

Most Users Ever Online: 628

Currently Online: Maverick, mrcvs, Manuel, rogertherelic, Big Larry, Erin Grivicich, TR
49 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)


Forum Stats:

Groups: 1

Forums: 16

Topics: 9183

Posts: 79070


Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 1238

Members: 10633

Moderators: 4

Admins: 3


Top Posters:

1873man: 4927

TXGunNut: 3360

clarence: 3240

Chuck: 2809

twobit: 2717

steve004: 2424

Maverick: 1801

Big Larry: 1631

JWA: 1605

RickC: 1408