Avatar
Search
Forum Scope




Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
Lost password?
sp_Feed sp_PrintTopic sp_TopicIcon
Model 12 12 gauge thoughts/ condition value
Avatar
zhammett
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 38
Member Since:
December 26, 2024
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
1
January 15, 2025 - 8:55 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Let’s try another. Model 12 12 gauge serial number 709925 from 1936

tempImageyHYMT5.jpgImage Enlarger

tempImageUoAj9L.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImageK1c1Vg.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImageUqlXnS.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImagejUaXSZ.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImage0MEID8.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImagep230bx.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImageSeOtkZ.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImageq75nYD.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImageMjNBq8.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImageOg3H9D.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImage3ORbPD.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImageZHTeIW.jpgImage Enlarger
tempImagepLrBDv.jpgImage Enlarger

Everything I'm posting is for sale

Avatar
TXGunNut
Northern edge of the D/FW Metromess
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 6487
Member Since:
November 7, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
2
January 16, 2025 - 3:35 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory

How long is the barrel? Looks like 26. 

 

Mike

Life Member TSRA, Endowment Member NRA
BBHC Member, TGCA Board Member
Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe
I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call, Lonesome Dove
Some of my favorite recipes start out with a handful of depleted counterbalance devices.-TXGunNut
Presbyopia be damned, I'm going to shoot this thing! -TXGunNut
Avatar
Deg
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 173
Member Since:
December 27, 2024
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
3
January 17, 2025 - 7:21 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Do you know, has the stock been replaced? 

Dan

Avatar
Bert H.
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 13002
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
4
January 17, 2025 - 7:38 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Deg said
Do you know, has the stock been replaced? 

  

The odds are better than 50/50 that the stocks were upgraded (not original).

Bert

WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
zhammett
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 38
Member Since:
December 26, 2024
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
5
January 17, 2025 - 7:45 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Any way for me to tell?

Everything I'm posting is for sale

Avatar
Bert H.
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 13002
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
6
January 17, 2025 - 7:59 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

zhammett said
Any way for me to tell?

  

No, not really.

What I see is a noticeable difference in the color and condition of the butt stock versus the slide handle stock.  It also appears that somebody attempted to refresh (recut) the checkering on the pistol grip portion of the butt stock.

Bert

WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Deg
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 173
Member Since:
December 27, 2024
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
7
January 17, 2025 - 11:45 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Bert H. said

zhammett said

Any way for me to tell?

  

No, not really.

What I see is a noticeable difference in the color and condition of the butt stock versus the slide handle stock.  It also appears that somebody attempted to refresh (recut) the checkering on the pistol grip portion of the butt stock.

Bert

  

That is what I think I saw also.

Dan

Avatar
zhammett
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 38
Member Since:
December 26, 2024
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
8
January 23, 2025 - 3:54 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Hopefully it’s just the lighting. Ill bring this one to Tulsa 

Everything I'm posting is for sale

Avatar
Anthony
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1043
Member Since:
December 9, 2002
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
9
January 23, 2025 - 1:04 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Great idea Zach!

 

Anthony

Avatar
Zebulon
Texas
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1215
Member Since:
January 20, 2023
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
10
January 24, 2025 - 10:45 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

I’m not sure this brings anything to the conversation but, after enlarging some of the images several diameters, here is what I think I see:

1. The Walnut buttstock appears to be from a blank of straight-grained heartwood, something Winchester tried to use when it was available because of its strength, durability and ability to take finer checkering. The Walnut forearm appears to be made of sapwood, with another grain pattern entirely, although the latter may just be the result of having been turned in the round. Still, I thought that, at least in early years, Winchester made an effort to match two-piece stocks. 

2. The topcoats appear to be of different ages – the buttstock appears to have been finished in an oil varnish that has darkened over years of Sunlight exposure. The forearm topcoat appears to be clear lacquer. 

3. I’m certain the checkering was done by different workmen — the forearm was inexpertly done; way too many overruns. I agree with Bert the pistol grip pattern was at least partially recut at some point. 

4. I’m less certain about this and may well be wrong, but, whereas the buttstock pattern is fullsome,  the forearm side panels look too narrow, as if done at a much later date.

The finer points of the Model 12 escape me and I’m sure there are clues I cannot see, but is it possible the buttstock was original and the forearm a much later replacement from factory inventory or fabricated by a local stockmaker?

- Bill 

 

WACA # 65205; life member, NRA; member, TGCA; member, TSRA; amateur preservationist

"I have seen wicked men and fools, a great many of both, and I believe they both get paid in the end, but the fools first." -- David Balfour, narrator and protagonist of the novel, Kidnapped, by Robert Louis Stevenson.

Avatar
Deg
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 173
Member Since:
December 27, 2024
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
11
January 25, 2025 - 4:18 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

I’d agree that the buttstock has been refinished – if you look at the close up of the butt-plate it looks like they just coated right over, at least the edge, of the butt-plate. That don’t look right  

Dan

Forum Timezone: UTC 0
Most Users Ever Online: 4623
Currently Online: Rick Hill, mark minnillo, Heather, Jeremy P, kevindpm61
Guest(s) 454
Top Posters:
clarence: 7119
TXGunNut: 6487
Chuck: 5890
steve004: 5217
1873man: 4706
deerhunter: 2713
Big Larry: 2561
twobit: 2505
mrcvs: 2213
Maverick: 2042
Newest Members:
Andy
James Luoma
DM2012
redfish282000
MFoster
Daltsav
Monk1950
Redcedar7T
KrzHorse
drjjpdc
Forum Stats:
Groups: 1
Forums: 18
Topics: 14829
Posts: 132764

 

Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 2057
Members: 10063
Moderators: 3
Admins: 4
Administrators: Mike Hager, Bert H., JWA, SethJ
Moderators: Rob Kassab, Brad Dunbar, Heather
Navigation