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1897 Riot Gun?
July 27, 2016
4:52 pm
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Joe9312
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Gentlemen:

- I was recently gifted a Winchester Model 1897 Shotgun with a short barrel.  I initially thought the barrel had been cut down sometime in the past, but then noticed that it was 20" long-- similar to those used on the 1897 Riot Model.  The serial number on the gun is "E8576XX" and my preliminary research indicates that it was made in 1930.  The gun has a solid frame with plain pistol grip walnut stock.  The top of the barrel is marked with Winchester patent info, "12ga.," and "CYL" choke.  The bottom of the barrel is marked "31" near the receiver end.  Aside from the serial number, there are no other markings on the receiver.  The right side of the trigger guard has been stamped "17," as has the bottom of the pistol grip (perhaps an armory rack number?). 

- Cody advised today that they do not have warehouse information on this gun, only the SNA (polishing room) date, thus they cannot confirm the gun's original configuration.  Can anyone out there tell me what else to look for to confirm/deny that I have/don't have a Riot Gun or perhaps point me towards someone or a reference book that can?

- Thanks in advance for the help!

July 28, 2016
3:56 am
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Kingston, WA
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Joe,

The partial serial number does indicate that it is a 1930 production receiver. The "31" on the bottom of the barrel tells us that it was made in 1931. Winchester was still making solid frame Riot Guns in that timeframe. The barrel length and the "CYL" marking on the left side of the barrel very strongly suggests that it is a factory original Riot Gun.

Bert

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July 28, 2016
4:14 pm
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Joe9312
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Bert:

- Thanks for the info.  I'm going to hang on to this gun-- its pretty darn sweet!  

July 29, 2016
12:46 am
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Bert, didn't some of the early 1897 brush guns have longer barrels with cyl bore barrels?  I'm not sure Winchester was still doing that in the 1930s.  But I've seen earlier long barrel cyl bore guns that had the barrels cut to 20".

July 29, 2016
2:01 am
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Kingston, WA
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Tom D said
Bert, didn't some of the early 1897 brush guns have longer barrels with cyl bore barrels?  I'm not sure Winchester was still doing that in the 1930s.  But I've seen earlier long barrel cyl bore guns that had the barrels cut to 20".  

Not that I have found.  Keep in mind that a standard Field grade gun was available with a CYL bore barrel from day one of production.  I have recorded several of them thus far with 32 and 30 inch barrels.  In the factory ledger records (up to serial number 377999), I have all of the "Brush Guns" are listed with the standard 26-inch barrel.  The vast majority of them have a CYL bore barrel, but there are a small number made with a MOD barrel.

In regards to the gun in question, I am nearly 100% certain that it is a factory Riot Gun, as I have several others recorded in the same serial number range.  Additionally, in the 825,000 to 900,000 serial range, all of the Model 97 solid frame guns that I have found have been factory Riot Guns.

Bert

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August 24, 2016
1:12 am
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From 1934 I believe:

 

http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag141/bushmaster1313/DSC_1915_zpserss1s5n.jpgImage Enlarger

http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag141/bushmaster1313/DSC_1914_zpsewqhkgnd.jpgImage Enlarger

http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag141/bushmaster1313/DSC_1910_zpsnhhgialc.jpgImage Enlarger

http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag141/bushmaster1313/DSC_1907_zps3x5m2si1.jpgImage Enlarger

http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag141/bushmaster1313/DSC_1897_zpsr7epqdv2.jpgImage Enlarger

http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag141/bushmaster1313/DSC_1902_zpsx9dioa2r.jpgImage Enlarger

August 24, 2016
1:49 am
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Kingston, WA
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What is the serial number? It appears to be an early 1920s production Riot Gun, most likely in the 740000 - 785000 serial range.

Bert

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August 24, 2016
2:39 am
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Bert H. said
What is the serial number? It appears to be an early 1920s production Riot Gun, most likely in the 740000 - 785000 serial range.
Bert  

E 858XXX

Making it 1937

August 24, 2016
3:32 am
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Kingston, WA
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How about posting the complete serial number?

Serial numbers 858000 - 858999 were all manufactured in early 1930 versus 1937. Where did you come up with that year? Did you use the look-up tool available on this website - http://winchestercollector.org/dates/

Bert

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August 24, 2016
3:09 pm
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Bert H. said
How about posting the complete serial number?
Serial numbers 858000 - 858999 were all manufactured in early 1930 versus 1937. Where did you come up with that year? Did you use the look-up tool available on this website - http://winchestercollector.org/dates/
Bert  

No. I think he used the "X" factor. Big Larry

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