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Winchester Model 70 -Van Orden- NM sniper.
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July 21, 2023 - 2:34 am
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  This  is  a  Winchester Model 70 NM  . 1939  reciever  & bolt–1950  barrel date. has  the factory Special order Sniper stock.,  plain  uncheckered ,  oil  finish..20230710_07033620068.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_07042020069.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_08524720072.jpgImage Enlarger20230715_14345520129.jpgImage Enlarger20230715_14494920123.jpgImage Enlarger20230715_14435720125.jpgImage Enlarger20230715_14362520127.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_15170220083.jpgImage Enlarger20230715_14455920124.jpgImage Enlarger Research Lt Col  George Van Orden,, Marine Corp snipers. He  began  ordering Model 70’s  in  1942  for WW2 . In 1950,  Van Orden  was  pushing Winchester  for a contract, this may  be  one  of  the samples, the triangle  proofs  on   barrel and bolt are missing.  This  stock split  thru  the inlet,long ago,

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July 21, 2023 - 2:42 am
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 Actually  National Match,  NM  rifles   get  a No1 standard barrel.  with choice  of Marksman  stock  or  Special Sniper  stock.  a  different  drop at  the heel. 20230720_22143520250.jpgImage Enlarger20230720_21565820251.jpgImage Enlarger20230720_22143520250-1.jpgImage Enlarger  there’s  lost  the  research to read,  under Van Orden  or Marine Corp  Model 70 snipers, NM  rifles..

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July 21, 2023 - 2:43 am
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Odd scope for any ’50s rifle; by then A5s were antiques.

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July 21, 2023 - 2:52 am
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wasn’t  on  it.     i stuck  it on  for  looks. that’s a B5..Am looking for a Unertl 8X, but have a Super Spot,  that would  be  appropiate. Having  the barrel  reblued. very recent acqusition,  Sunday.before last… It will be  set up for  either “open sights  or long range telescope. ” NM barrel..

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July 21, 2023 - 3:12 am
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 In 1950  the Korean War  was gearing  up. Long Range sniper rifles  were  again  ,in demand. In 1939  Winchester declared  all 30-06 caliber  guns  were designated  foe military  use.  1950 was  the same.  Van Odden was  trying  to get Winchester a contract, but the Remington 40X won  the military contract.      George Van Orden  ,after leaving  the Marines ,set up a store  for Marine  target shooters -sniper  in Virginia , Evaluators Ltd. where most of  the medium  heavy barrels,   target rifles  were sold  thru..

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July 21, 2023 - 3:31 pm
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20230710_08552620070.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_09313120074.jpgImage Enlarger20230719_15404420188.jpgImage Enlarger20230720_21564320252.jpgImage Enlarger  The  stock  split  thru  the inlet a long  time ago,  maybe at Winchester  testing.  there was a almost 1/8th  gap at  the  rear of  the tang  that caused  it,.to split,  luckily   it wasn’t shot much after  that. see  the color on  the reciever and bolt  extractor ,..Before  the  replies   tell me about  the 40K to 50K range  for Van orden  ,those numbers are  post 1950.   Orden  ordered  Snipers  built  during WW2 as well/, This  is  the same  Type 1 reciever  that  was prefferred   for  the early  ones. The post 1940 rifles are built on  target  recievers,  in 1950 Winchester  began  slotting  the target recievers only, again , for  springfield. stripper clips to make   them compliant  with NM rules..

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July 21, 2023 - 3:54 pm
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Ralph Fitzwater said
   there was a almost 1/8th  gap at  the  rear of  the tang  that caused  it,.to split, 

  

I’ve read that on ’03 Springfields (from which 70s derive) a small gap, though maybe not 1/8th, was deliberately left to reduce the chance of splitting.  It was believed that a tight fit could lead to splitting.

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July 21, 2023 - 4:10 pm
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Ralph Fitzwater said
20230710_08552620070.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_09313120074.jpgImage Enlarger20230719_15404420188.jpgImage Enlarger20230720_21564320252.jpgImage Enlarger  The  stock  split  thru  the inlet a long  time ago,  maybe at Winchester  testing.  there was a almost 1/8th  gap at  the  rear of  the tang  that caused  it,.to split,  luckily   it wasn’t shot much after  that. see  the color on  the reciever and bolt  extractor ,..Before  the  replies   tell me about  the 40K to 50K range  for Van orden  ,those numbers are  post 1950.   Orden  ordered  Snipers  built  during WW2 as well/, This  is  the same  Type 1 reciever  that  was prefferred   for  the early  ones. The post 1940 rifles are built on  target  recievers,  in 1950 Winchester  began  slotting  the target recievers only, again , for  springfield. stripper clips to make   them compliant  with NM rules..

  

You asked about the 40K – 50K serial number range… per the Polishing Room records, those numbers were all applied to the receiver frames in 1941 & 1942, and as such, they are not post 1950.  Accordingly, they are technically “pre-war”.  If you have a more specific serial number range, please specify it.

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July 21, 2023 - 4:18 pm
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Ralph Fitzwater said
  This  is  a  Winchester Model 70 NM  . 1939  reciever  & bolt–1950  barrel date. has  the factory Special order Sniper stock.,  plain  uncheckered ,  oil  finish..20230710_07033620068.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_07042020069.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_08524720072.jpgImage Enlarger20230715_14345520129.jpgImage Enlarger20230715_14494920123.jpgImage Enlarger20230715_14435720125.jpgImage Enlarger20230715_14362520127.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_15170220083.jpgImage Enlarger20230715_14455920124.jpgImage Enlarger Research Lt Col  George Van Orden,, Marine Corp snipers. He  began  ordering Model 70’s  in  1942  for WW2 . In 1950,  Van Orden  was  pushing Winchester  for a contract, this may  be  one  of  the samples, the triangle  proofs  on   barrel and bolt are missing.  This  stock split  thru  the inlet,long ago,

  

In viewing the pictures of this rifle, the S/N appears to be 20082.  If that is the correct serial number, it was manufactured in the latter half of July 1938.

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July 21, 2023 - 8:25 pm
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 This  is  serial number 26062  late  1939..  Clarence   The Model 70 was  derived  from  the Model 54,  in 1936. not  the Springfield.. I’ve  seen and own a number of  both and  yet  to see an”1/8th  gap, behind  the  reciever tang  , as  the  space  provides room  to move  under heavy  30-06 recoil. The point of  bedding  target stocks  is  to make a more  precise fit between  wood and metal..so it won’t  split.  The  grain can  react  to repeated shock,  of movement , till it pops apart..     Bert— There are two distinct   groups of Van Orden Marine Snipers. The  First  group  being  in the 40K to 50K , built  during WW2.  They  were  promoted by Van Orden for use in the Pacific Theatre. they are all a Type  1  reciever  with stripper clip slots,  that began on  the Model 54. Remember Winchester was veeing for military  rifle  contracts..The Museum  lists a sample Model 54  in full military  stock..  The  second batch of Van Orden Marine Sniper rifles are in the 300xxx range and up built on modified  Type  2 recievers. . Theres a number of posts  thout  the forum  on Van Orden snipers. Those  300xxx and up numbers are listed in Chandler’s book “Death from Afar” They were private  sales,   facilitated  by Van Orden  thru  his gun shop Evaluators  in Triangle VA.  Van Orden  ordered  thru Winchester. for  the  medium heavy barreled  target  recievers  with stripper clip slots..they  were sold  commercially   to him as an FFL shop,to  service members  rifle team  members..they should have  every commercial inspection  proof Winchester applies.. Mine  is 1950. and  was  using up every  leftover type 1 reciever on hand, until Winchester  management  reimplimented  the  slots in only  the  target madels, thus accomodating military  requirements…20230717_16211520165.jpgImage Enlarger   i have  restructured  inside, too  that  it won’t  split  under  use. as it was  a few more boxes would have  popped   the  wrist in two.eventually.. few  hardened steel pins, arsenal style..

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July 21, 2023 - 9:05 pm
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   Clarence   The Model 70 was  derived  from  the Model 54,  in 1936. not  the Springfield..Ralph Fitzwater said

  

Sure, but the 54 is almost an ’03 clone.

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July 21, 2023 - 10:08 pm
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And both were heavily influenced by the Mauser ’98.  I remember reading somewhere that there was a lawsuit by Mauser against Springfield for patent infringement on their ’98 rifle, which was made moot by the outcome of World War I.

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July 21, 2023 - 10:25 pm
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Blue Ridge Parson said
And both were heavily influenced by the Mauser ’98.  I remember reading somewhere that there was a lawsuit by Mauser against Springfield for patent infringement on their ’98 rifle, which was made moot by the outcome of World War I. 

Actually, US eventually paid for the pat infringement. But it was not for the basic design of the action, despite the obvious resemblance of the two–it was for the Mauser stripper-clip.

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July 21, 2023 - 11:20 pm
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 The 1903  was a patent  infringement  from Mauser 98. As bolt actions  goes, Mauser  defined  it..everyone  else copied  it. it was under  the 7  years. from 1898 Mauser – patent.  see  where  the space    led  to splitting  the stock. right  thru , .the screw  slams against  the back of  the screw hole. like a hammer   banging on it..pop the layer at  the  wrist..wait  till it splits and force glue in. ?         There is a thin fiberglass “bedding  painted inside  the  reciever inlet.. aren’t  most rifles  bare wood inside? 20230710_1516412305843009270352757.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_0931082305843009270352755.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_0931182305843009270352756.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_09313120074-1.jpgImage Enlarger20230710_09321320073.jpgImage Enlarger 

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July 22, 2023 - 12:01 am
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Ralph Fitzwater said  There is a thin fiberglass “bedding  painted inside  the  reciever inlet.. aren’t  most rifles  bare wood inside? 
  

Yes.  Some previous owner must have done it.

As for the crack, I don’t think there’s much to be done at this point, & it may never get worse; it it does, cross that bridge when you come to it.

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July 22, 2023 - 2:43 am
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clarence. it’s  said  the Van Orden Sniper  rifles  were  bedded  with  thin fiberglass, by Van Orden,   theres no reason  to  think he  didn’t  require it  in his dileberatins failed or not  for a contract in 1950..  Obviously  you don’t  look too closley at  the photos  posted  of  repair.. your  “two cents” is irrelevant..

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