Avatar
Please consider registering
Guest
Search
Forum Scope




Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
Register Lost password?
sp_Feed sp_PrintTopic sp_TopicIcon
Winchester Model 65 in .218 Bee
sp_NewTopic Add Topic
Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 94
Member Since:
September 14, 2016
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
1
July 27, 2021 - 3:32 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Hi All, I am bidding at a Winchester model 65 in .218 BEE on an auction site. The Serial number as reported is 1006190. They aren’t showing pictures of the barrel top or the the bottom of the receiver showing the serial number, which makes me a little suspicious. 

Bert mentioned in a previous post, that 65’s in 218 BEE usually had a bolt peep sight. This rifle does not have that, nor does it appear to be drilled for one.            IMG_3748.JPGImage EnlargerIMG_3749.JPGImage Enlarger

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Richard Pike

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1652
Member Since:
September 22, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
2
July 27, 2021 - 3:41 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Ask the auction house or email the private seller that you want photographs of the areas that depict the serial number and barrel markings, or any other areas desired.

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 232
Member Since:
September 21, 2016
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
3
July 27, 2021 - 4:12 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

I noticed the other 65 in that auction is not drilled either… 

Avatar
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 10589
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
4
July 27, 2021 - 5:46 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

Richard Pike said
Hi All, I am bidding at a Winchester model 65 in .218 BEE on an auction site. The Serial number as reported is 1006190. They aren’t showing pictures of the barrel top or the the bottom of the receiver showing the serial number, which makes me a little suspicious. 

Bert mentioned in a previous post, that 65’s in 218 BEE usually had a bolt peep sight. This rifle does not have that, nor does it appear to be drilled for one.            IMG_3748.JPGImage EnlargerIMG_3749.JPGImage Enlarger

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Richard Pike  

I would ask for pictures showing the top and bottom of the receiver frame.  There were a relatively small number of Model 65 218 Bee rifles that were not manufactured to mount a No. 98C bolt peep sight.  That stated, there are also an equal number of Model 65 rifles that were altered to the 218 Bee cartridge (barrel swap) and are fakes.  The clue is how or if they will properly cycle the 218 Bee cartridge from the magazine to the chamber and out again.

Bert

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Northwest Missouri
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 120
Member Since:
February 24, 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
5
July 28, 2021 - 12:23 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

The other model 65 in the auction is a 32 WCF, so is less likely to have the bolt mounted peep sight.  The front sight does not look quite correct to me or may be correct for an early 65? Serial number 1001151 indicates 1930, which would be very early for a model 65.

Any thoughts? 

Kevin

https://www.proxibid.com/Firearms-Military-Artifacts/Firearms/Winchester-Model-65-32-WCF-Rifle/lotInformation/62641024

Avatar
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 10589
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
6
July 28, 2021 - 3:35 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Colsuper said
The other model 65 in the auction is a 32 WCF, so is less likely to have the bolt mounted peep sight.  The front sight does not look quite correct to me or may be correct for an early 65? Serial number 1001151 indicates 1930, which would be very early for a model 65.

Any thoughts? 

Kevin

https://www.proxibid.com/Firearms-Military-Artifacts/Firearms/Winchester-Model-65-32-WCF-Rifle/lotInformation/62641024  

Kevin,

S/N 1001151 is a 1933 production rifle, not 1930.  The Model 65 serial numbers actually began in the 999600 range (which was late 1932).  I currently have (34) Model 65 rifles verified in my research survey with a S/N < 1001151. 

In regards to the front sight, some of the early production Model 65 ramp sights did not have a groove milled in them for a sight hood.  It is ultra rare to find a No. 98C bolt peep sight on a Model 65 rifle in caliber 25-20 WCF or 32 WCF.

Bert

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Northwest Missouri
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 120
Member Since:
February 24, 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
7
July 29, 2021 - 1:30 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Thank you, Bert.  The 1930 date came from the resources tab on the WACA site.  The 1933 makes a lot more sense and I appreciate knowing that the early ramp sights were not milled for a hood.  

Avatar
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 10589
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
8
July 29, 2021 - 1:46 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

I

Colsuper said
Thank you, Bert.  The 1930 date came from the resources tab on the WACA site.  The 1933 makes a lot more sense and I appreciate knowing that the early ramp sights were not milled for a hood.    

I will have to investigate the Resource tab and get it updated.

WACA 6571L, Historian & Board of Director Member
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Santa Clara, CA
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 778
Member Since:
January 27, 1992
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
9
July 29, 2021 - 3:44 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

Hope this helps.  The bolts modified for the peep sight have extensive machining done.  They are not just tapped.  I have a late 92 carbine with a bolt peep and the hooded ramp front sight.  I have seen one 92 rifle with the bolt peep.  “Parts clean up” or “Frankenchester”?  We will never know.  No provenance.   RDB

BOLT-W-PEEP-RELIEF-001.JPGImage EnlargerBOLT-W-PEEP-RELIEF-002.JPGImage EnlargerBOLT-W-PEEP-RELIEF-003.JPGImage EnlargerBOLT-W-PEEP-RELIEF-004.JPGImage Enlarger 

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 94
Member Since:
September 14, 2016
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
10
August 2, 2021 - 2:40 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_EditHistory sp_QuotePost

Bert H. said

I would ask for pictures showing the top and bottom of the receiver frame.  There were a relatively small number of Model 65 218 Bee rifles that were not manufactured to mount a No. 98C bolt peep sight.  That stated, there are also an equal number of Model 65 rifles that were altered to the 218 Bee cartridge (barrel swap) and are fakes.  The clue is how or if they will properly cycle the 218 Bee cartridge from the magazine to the chamber and out again.

Bert  

Hi Bert, Thank you for your help on this. I received an email back from Angela Bertalot at Cody Firearms, telling me no records exist for the rifle in question. She said the serial number I supplied to her fell into a gap in their records. Therefore, I assume I can neither prove or disprove that this Model 65 left the factory in the 218 BEE configuration. Other than not having the bolt peep sight, there is no way of being sure. It is either a very rare model or a fake.

By the way, I asked for additional pictures and got no response.

Thanks again for your help. Richard

Forum Timezone: UTC 0
Most Users Ever Online: 778
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
clarence: 6133
TXGunNut: 4848
Chuck: 4509
1873man: 4255
steve004: 4091
Big Larry: 2287
twobit: 2280
TR: 1686
mrcvs: 1652
Forum Stats:
Groups: 1
Forums: 17
Topics: 12474
Posts: 108270

 

Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 1725
Members: 8699
Moderators: 4
Admins: 3
Navigation