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Winchester 1892 25-20 bore obstruction
March 22, 2020
7:49 pm
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So I've acquired a Winchester 1892 in 25-20. Serial number 916252. Which I believe was made in 1927. Found what I thought was a bullet lodged in the barrel about 6in from the muzzle. After taking it to a gunsmith and dismantled it he found what he thinks that someone has poured lead down the barrel. The obstruction is at the chamber end also. He thinks this could of been done to make it a movie prop gun. Weird... I know.  Why wasn't the firing pin just removed ? He believes the gun has never been fired by the condition of the actions internal parts. No wear or tear. Cant buy into this because he said you can still chamber a round in it.  A bomb waiting to happen if fired. Any thoughts. Thx. Doug 

March 22, 2020
9:58 pm
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Except for heating up the brl hot enough to melt it out (which doesn't sound like a good idea!), suspect it's going to have to be drilled out. 

March 23, 2020
10:53 am
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Lead melts at a touch over 700*.  You can use a propane torch to melt it and still not hurt the blueing. I would use a bore scope to find out exactly what you dealing with before taking any action. You can also check the bore condition for previous Bubba attempts at removing it.

 

Erin

March 23, 2020
1:00 pm
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Ok. Thx. I'm taking it to another gunsmith for a second opinion .Sorry. Not meaning your guys advice. Gunsmith said he could drill it out but said I should do some research on it first. Thx for your replies

March 23, 2020
5:11 pm
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Heating to 700 F may not affect the bluing but it could impact the tempering process.  Be very careful and get input from someone knowledgeable about heat treatment of barrel steel.

Nevada Paul

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March 23, 2020
11:41 pm
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Nevada Paul said
Heating to 700 F may not affect the bluing but it could impact the tempering process. 

Very possibly--heating to a moderate temp is generally how you soften hardened metals, as when annealing case necks.  On the other hand, some kinds of barrel repair involve spot welding which I haven't heard of causing loss of temper.  A question for a metallurgist to resolve.

March 24, 2020
3:45 pm
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Yes. I'm picking it up tonight and taking to another gunsmith with a better borescope.  Could be an interesting project.  But not for me !!!!!!

March 24, 2020
6:10 pm
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Ask someone doing barrel lining (or re-lining, as most people say) about drilling out the obstruction, which should be an easy job, esp. if you have the barrel unscrewed & send them only that.  The only piece of equipment necessary to do it that the average gunsmith lacks is a deep-hole drill, thought the cost of these is not prohibitive.  There are even do-it-yourself lining videos on You Tube.

March 24, 2020
10:52 pm
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If it's lead, why can't you drive it out like when slugging a barrel?

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March 24, 2020
11:17 pm
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clarence said
Ask someone doing barrel lining (or re-lining, as most people say) about drilling out the obstruction, which should be an easy job, esp. if you have the barrel unscrewed & send them only that.  The only piece of equipment necessary to do it that the average gunsmith lacks is a deep-hole drill, thought the cost of these is not prohibitive.  There are even do-it-yourself lining videos on You Tube.  

You would have to make a special drill that can't ride on the rifling so there would be lead remaining.

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March 24, 2020
11:41 pm
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1873man said

You would have to make a special drill that can't ride on the rifling so there would be lead remaining.

Bob  

Even so, couldn't that be removed with some combination of solvent & brushes?  The Lewis lead remover is not made for bores that small, but I think a rod could be rigged up to make use of the Lewis brass patches.  Scrubbing out the lead certainly won't be an easy job, whatever is used.  If liquid mercury could be obtained, that would make the job much easier.  Until I somehow lost my small supply during one of my many moves, that was always how I dealt with leading.

March 25, 2020
1:09 am
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Old Logger said
If it's lead, why can't you drive it out like when slugging a barrel?  

Was thinking the same thing.  So long as both obstructions are lead (and not necessarily lead connected to a primed smaller caliber cartridge thats been slid down the bore by accident) I would likely do the same and try to drive it out with a wood dowel or a long piece of brass rod of slightly smaller diameter than the bore. 

However, if its lead poured from one end of the barrel to the other, that may be a bit difficult task to drive out. 

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March 25, 2020
11:21 am
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I was thinking that if you ran an orange hot rod up a down pointed barrel that the lead would run out without heating the barrel.

March 26, 2020
6:10 pm
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These are all great ideas and good input.  Unfortunately.... with this Covid 19 going on my gunship closes before I can get offwork. But we're gonna make arrangements.  . I'll have more info when we run a Hawkeye  borescope through it. Thx. I'll be back. !!

March 27, 2020
10:24 pm
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tyke
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I've been gunsmithing for 42 years and I gotta tell ya...some of those suggestions scare the bejesus out of me.  

If it is lead that has been poured down the barrel it may not have adhered to the metal too badly.  If, however, the bore has any pitting/rust etc..., forget it.

If it's a bad barrel (based on bore scoping whatever amount you can see) get the barrel relined by a competent gunsmith.  That entails a long, slow, tedious process but in the end...assuming the gun is worth the effort/expense... you have something useable.

Don't try pounding.  That tends to expand the lead seizing within the bore.  Heating and trying to melt out the "lead" may cause it to adhere to the bore walls and you'll never get it out with brushes.  If it is heated, coat the remaining bore with thin oil and lamp black or fine carbon dust.  Years ago when sperm oil was available that was mixed with lamp black to keep lead from adhering where you didn't want it to.

And then, there's always finding another replacement barrel...

March 28, 2020
1:26 pm
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tyke said

If it's a bad barrel (based on bore scoping whatever amount you can see) get the barrel relined by a competent gunsmith.  That entails a long, slow, tedious process but in the end...assuming the gun is worth the effort/expense... you have something useable.  

In the end, this is probably what will have to be done, & it can be done in such a way that the work is not immediately obvious.  (Though a shiny new bore in an old gun is always a red flag.)  A good replacement brl might even be cheaper, but finding one of the right age, right markings, & with a finish to match the mag tube, etc., will take a lot of searching.

March 28, 2020
2:18 pm
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I know that if I posted this among a gentler crowd there would be fainting,  fuming, and finger pointing.  That said,  just as an exercise in free expression in thought,  have you considered MERCURY as a way to remove the lead?

March 28, 2020
3:48 pm
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jban said
I know that if I posted this among a gentler crowd there would be fainting,  fuming, and finger pointing.  That said,  just as an exercise in free expression in thought,  have you considered MERCURY as a way to remove the lead?  

clarence said

If liquid mercury could be obtained, that would make the job much easier.  Until I somehow lost my small supply during one of my many moves, that was always how I dealt with leading.  

March 28, 2020
3:58 pm
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Even if a small quantity of mercury could be found (where?), it would never dissolve a solid plug of lead, only pick up the residue left in the grooves.

March 28, 2020
5:46 pm
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tyke
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Ditto

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