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steve004 said
Your DI must have been coming from the, “no pain, no gain” perspective. Personally, I see that as poorly applicable to target shooting
We also shot at Chapel Flats (sp?) and I had #26. When in the prone position, the same DI came and stood with one boot upon my back and the other pushing my face into the pavement, and said (YELLED):
“You better shoot well, maggot. This was Lee Harvey Oswald’s target!”
I don’t know if that was true or not, but he didn’t do that to anyone else. I shot Sharpshooter, and only one point below Expert. Ugh! 
Huck Riley said
steve004 said
Your DI must have been coming from the, “no pain, no gain” perspective. Personally, I see that as poorly applicable to target shooting
We also shot at Chapel Flats (sp?) and I had #26. When in the prone position, the same DI came and stood with one boot upon my back and the other pushing my face into the pavement, and said (YELLED):
“You better shoot well, maggot. This was Lee Harvey Oswald’s target!”
I don’t know if that was true or not, but he didn’t do that to anyone else. I shot Sharpshooter, and only one point below Expert. Ugh!
WOW! I’ve got to say that sounds an awful lot like a video I’ve seen over and over on the television lately 
steve004 said
WOW! I’ve got to say that sounds an awful lot like a video I’ve seen over and over on the television lately
Pray tell? I haven’t seen it, but would like to. Knowing well the creation of legend, urban or otherwise, I wouldn’t doubt it has happened to others.
Huck Riley said
Pray tell? I haven’t seen it, but would like to. Knowing well the creation of legend, urban or otherwise, I wouldn’t doubt it has happened to others.
Poor taste on my part. I meant the TV news video I’ve seen over and over the last few days of the fellow having his head pressed into the pavement. That’s just where my mind went when I read your tale of having your head pressed into the pavement.
steve004 said
Poor taste on my part. I meant the TV news video I’ve seen over and over the last few days of the fellow having his head pressed into the pavement. That’s just where my mind went when I read your tale of having your head pressed into the pavement.
I did a search and saw some guy saying Oswald shot on B range, #40 at Edson Range, while the twitter guy shot on #39. So it’s out there, and disputed. LOL! In any event, our DI’s, while zealous in their duties, did not kill us. We did have one Recruit blow his own head off (intentionally) during a Prac Test with a round he snuck back from the range. But other than that, no one died while I was there.
Huck Riley said
When in the Marine Corps, we had as standard the off-hand, kneeling, sitting and prone. I hated the kneeling; that is if I had to do it the way the DI made me do it. My body, even at 18, was not cut out for that crap. That did not stop him from forcing me into that position, just shy of breaking bones and ripping tendons. Now, if I were to assume a kneeling position of my choosing, I might actually hit something.
Look at any good manual on shooting positions, & you’ll see that for each of the 4 positions there are equally acceptable variations based on individual anatomy–long arms & legs vs short arms & legs, thick vs thin chest, etc. There’s no absolutely right & wrong stance. Before my ankles gave out, I found kneeling the most useful, because it can be assumed quicker, but now, due to back & ankle problems, I can only shoot off-hand, & if I tried to get into the other positions someone would have to help me get back up–literally.
Huck Riley said
steve004 said
Your DI must have been coming from the, “no pain, no gain” perspective. Personally, I see that as poorly applicable to target shooting
We also shot at Chapel Flats (sp?) and I had #26. When in the prone position, the same DI came and stood with one boot upon my back and the other pushing my face into the pavement, and said (YELLED):
“You better shoot well, maggot. This was Lee Harvey Oswald’s target!”
I don’t know if that was true or not, but he didn’t do that to anyone else. I shot Sharpshooter, and only one point below Expert. Ugh!
Huck Riley said
steve004 said
Your DI must have been coming from the, “no pain, no gain” perspective. Personally, I see that as poorly applicable to target shooting
We also shot at Chapel Flats (sp?) and I had #26. When in the prone position, the same DI came and stood with one boot upon my back and the other pushing my face into the pavement, and said (YELLED):
“You better shoot well, maggot. This was Lee Harvey Oswald’s target!”
I don’t know if that was true or not, but he didn’t do that to anyone else. I shot Sharpshooter, and only one point below Expert. Ugh!
I think you might be embellishing the Chappo Flats story just a wee bit, Huck Riley! 
The firing lines are not made out of pavement, just dirt! Good story though!!! 
jwm94 said
It’s been well over 40 years, but I certainly don’t remember dirt. Maybe asphalt, but not dirt. There were white lines and numbers painted between, and in front of each slot. I did qual many times over the years but each range, Chappo (thanks), Edson, MCBH, Puuloa and others had something other than dirt.
Huck Riley said
It’s been well over 40 years, but I certainly don’t remember dirt. Maybe asphalt, but not dirt. There were white lines and numbers painted between, and in front of each slot. I did qual many times over the years but each range, Chappo (thanks), Edson, MCBH, Puuloa and others had something other than dirt.
During my 21 year career in the Corps, they were dirt. That was 60 through 81. I was a DI from Winter of 68 through June of 71. When the road to Edson flooded out during this time, I took my prives to Chappo Flats. I, too, was at MCAS Kanehoe Bay with 3/4. And I was in the Corps’ first official Vietnam era Sniper School at Puuloa (1962), and later shot some matches there as a team member with Marine Barracks LualuaLei. I really did enjoy Hawaii!! I took my boot training at Xamp Matthews and was lucky enough to be the second highest shooter in my series with a score of 231. Schoff from another platoon fired a killer 236! I ran into him in the NAM…he was with the 26th Marine Regiment back then. 219 is a killer score as well.
Oorah…Brother.
jwm94 said
Huck Riley said
It’s been well over 40 years, but I certainly don’t remember dirt. Maybe asphalt, but not dirt. There were white lines and numbers painted between, and in front of each slot. I did qual many times over the years but each range, Chappo (thanks), Edson, MCBH, Puuloa and others had something other than dirt.
During my 21 year career in the Corps, they were dirt. That was 60 through 81. I was a DI from Winter of 68 through June of 71. When the road to Edson flooded out during this time, I took my prives to Chappo Flats. I, too, was at MCAS Kanehoe Bay with 3/4. And I was in the Corps’ first official Sniper School at Puuloa (1962), and later shot some matches there as a team member with Marine Barracks LualuaLei. I really did enjoy Hawaii!! I took my boot training at Xamp Matthews and was lucky enough to be the second highest shooter in my series with a score of 231. Schoff from another platoon fired a killer 236! I ran into him in the NAM…he was with the 26th Marine Regiment back then. 219 is a killer score as well.
Oorah…Brother.
Well, that covered my time in so I guess I have to defer to you. But I sure don’t remember dirt. I remember policing brass off hard surface, painted lines, and having my face shoved in it. Maybe I’m conflating experiences in my brain.
I was 0321/8653 from 76-80 out of KBay. I do remember we were supposed to go to Edson in boot, but the Corps was overwhelmed with people trying to get in under the old GI Bill. Edson was booked so they put us on Chappo. While KBay was home, I spent a lot of time over seas, back east, etc. Semper Fi. P.S. This looks more like what I remember:
I got to thinking and remembered I still have my old boot grad book. Our Honor Man and high shooter was R.M Rivera, who shot a 240. The standard color pictures of the range show pavement or asphalt. However, those are stock photos. Our individual photos could be dirt or pavement or asphalt, it’s hard to tell in black and white and crappy photos.
I had 15 platoons in 42 months, but only have about 10 annual inserts for my big book. They show dirt firing lines, but things could have changed by the time you went through. And, I must admit the picture you show looks very strange to me. I hate to think what condition my elbows, knees, and boots would be in after qual week! The picture you show looks like a typical range at Edson, but the line is strange!
jwm94 said
I had 15 platoons in 42 months, but only have about 10 annual inserts for my big book. They show dirt firing lines, but things could have changed by the time you went through. And, I must admit the picture you show looks very strange to me. I hate to think what condition my elbows, knees, and boots would be in after qual week! The picture you show looks like a typical range at Edson, but the line is strange!
Here’s some pics from my 3rd Bn Book and one from the Graduation pamphlet. The first pic, like I said, is a stock photo. Pissed me off when I found out the book was a bunch of nice, big color photos (which I thought we’d get, of us, when they sold us these things) with a bunch of crap, small, black and white photos stuffed in the end. LOL! What a rip off. But that photo shows some kind of pavement.
Anyway, the second photo is actually us. And, it does look like dirt. So I don’t know what to say.
The last photo lists the high shooters. Rivera was in my platoon. There was another 240, a 239 and a 236.
Huck Riley said
So I don’t know what to say.
Huck, The only thing you, or anyone, can truly say is that our memory is unreliable, prone to all sorts of self-deceptions. That’s why so-called “oral-history” is the total bunk.
clarence said
Huck, The only thing you, or anyone, can truly say is that our memory is unreliable, prone to all sorts of self-deceptions. That’s why so-called “oral-history” is the total bunk.
That may be true, but saddle rings are awesome and crescent butts are the bee knees. 
Huck Riley said
That may be true, but saddle rings are awesome and crescent butts are the bee knees.
Saddle rings are awesome? Can you explain their purpose?
Do you think it might be some kind of synthetic material. That makes more sense than inviting some very serious injuries and disabilities into old age.
jwm94 said
Do you think it might be some kind of synthetic material. That makes more sense than inviting some very serious injuries and disabilities into old age.
I got to thinking about that and googled the invention of rubberized asphalt. Because I remember we had that in track & field in school. It was invented in the early 60s, I think. I know it was pretty forgiving. But I don’t remember the stuff in the Corps being that way, but, like Clarence says about memory and age . . .
November 7, 2015
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FWIW I’ve always found a good kneeling position to be the best compromise between speed, accuracy and visibility of the target. And yes, I may be a little slow getting up but can still assume it without delay. No military experience, just years of PPC competition and hunting.
Mike
Huck Riley said
Saddle rings are awesome? Can you explain their purpose?
Maybe I’m wrong, but the background of this photo hints that this scene may not quite be “period.” (Very good looking saddle, though.) So, among the thousands of original cowboy & “Old West” photos available on line from museums & archives, I challenge you to find ONE that shows a SRC carried this way. $100 says it can’t be done.
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