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94Deluxe said
Don sold me a supposedly all original, high condition 1890. Gun was totally redone stem to stern. He took it back no problem, to sell to someone else (hopefully less knowledgeable) as all original. Was back on his site with same price/description.
Totally unethical. Sad
Vince
Southern Oregon
NRA member
Fraternal Order of Eagles
“There is but one answer to be made to the dynamite bomb and that can best be made by the Winchester rifle.”
Teddy Roosevelt
August 11, 2015
Offline
Took a long look at the Grove site and agree that there are some really nice guns on there, but also noticed some perceived inconsistencies from my perspective.
I look at a lot of sites primarily to get a better feel for what people call % blue, cased color harden, fit of wood, refinish, etc. I don’t know how else to get smarter, not only of what I have already collected, but also what I want my collection to look like.
One of my big hang ups is the serial number. When I first joined WACA I got the advice to put on the entire serial number when discussing a particular gun and have kind of stuck to that notion. I don’t understand why people don’t want to reveal the whole number.
I also have a concern when someone says that the wood is probably a XX or XXX or XXXX. I am under the impression that in most instances if the gun was made with anything other than the standard wood it would have the lower tang stamped with the appropriate number of X’s. I may be uninformed on this point but cant understand why someone would not at least pull the stock to look.
The barrel condition is also a challenge for me. I find the pictures of the bore to be very comforting when viewing a gun on line, and don’t see why there is not 100% compliance on this issue.
Thanks in advance for any feedback on the above issues.
Mark,
The X rating of wood is not always marked on the tang. I would guess 25% of the guns with other than straight grain are marked. It was common practice by Winchester to put a better grade of wood on a gun if it had any kind of special feature especially case hardening.
Bob
WACA Life Member--- NRA Life Member---- Cody Firearms member since 1991 Researching the Winchester 1873's
Email: [email protected]
Mark,
In regards to serial numbers, I like you, do not understand why some people feel the need to use the “xxx” instead of posting the complete serial number.
Like Bob mentioned, not all Winchesters with fancy “XX” or “XXX” wood will be marked as such on the lower tang. For the Model 1885, the higher grade rifles (e.g. Special Sporting Rifle, Special Single Shot Rifle, and Schuetzen Rifle), fancy wood was standard, so in many instances, Winchester did not mark the tang, or make specific mention of it in the warehouse ledger. A perfect example is the Special Sporting Rifle (bottom rifle) in my signature picture. It has XXX grade wood (which was standard), but it is not marked on the lower tang, and it does not mention it in the factory letter. In regards to pulling the stocks to check for the numbers of Xs, some people are uncomfortable doing it for fear of damaging the stocks. The fancy grain Americal Black walnut can crack and chip if you are not careful.
Bore condition is not important to everyone, and it is difficult for most people to capture it adequatekly in a picture. In my opinion, the bore should be inspected with the rifle in hand.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
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