Log In
Members
Home
Add Reply
Add Topic
I was gifted a serial #18,XXX model 70 in 22 hornet that was converted to a single shot .222 (probably in the 50’s). The magazine still holds 22 hornets. The rifle no longer ejects shells. I would like to take it back to a 22 hornet. I have heard of a company called cutrifle.com that makes staged barrels for m70’s. For about $800 they will make a barrel and reblue the rifle. Since they are not in the counterfeiting business they do not stamped winchester on the barrels. Has anyone had a similar experience? I would like an authentic Winchester barrel, is there a source? What was removed that prohibits shell from ejecting (I presume the ejector)? The goal is a functioning shooting rifle as authentic as possible.
November 5, 2014
Offline
FLT-
That might be a challenge (or at least expensive). The rim diameter of .22 Hornet is 0.350″ and the corresponding bolt face recess of the M70 Hornet bolt is 0.356″. The rim diameter of 222 Remington is 0.378″. So the bolt face may be an issue. I would guess that the conversion involved opening up the bolt face, shortening the extractor lip so now it won’t grab the Hornet case rim, changing the bolt stop on the extractor collar to allow extraction/ejection of the longer Remington case, and altering the ejector. Hence 22 Hornet cartridges will feed but not extract…
Roger Rule’s Model 70 book has some clear photos of the 22 Hornet action parts that would let you tell what is missing/modified. The 22 Hornet had several specialized action components that may no longer be there. These components can be found, although sadly I don’t have any of them as spare parts.
As for the barrel… Even if you find an original take-off Hornet barrel that has not been rechambered to Kilbourne Hornet, it will likely have the “wrong” markings on it. An 18K serial number rifle would probably have a ’36 to ’38 barrel date and carry the first style exposed roll markings (both left and right sides of the barrel). So any later Hornet barrel (made after ’40) would be an obvious rebarrel. I understand that you are not trying to “counterfeit” an original pre-war Hornet, but if you do want it to look right you’ll need to find a pretty early 22 Hornet pre-war barrel. Otherwise might as well go for a new production custom barrel.
Just my opinion,
Lou
WACA 9519; Studying Pre-64 Model 70 Winchesters
Louis Luttrell has just provided what appears to me a wonderful technical analysis concerning your rifle situation. Such far beyond my capability.
Yet just to step back a few clicks. You have a rather extensively modified Model 70. Likely quite expensive to convert back and even ignoring the economics of the matter, a rifle which still isn’t and never will be original. A compromised ‘put together’ at best. I suppose were it done very professionally it might qualify as ‘restored’. But I don’t personally count such a rifle in that category. The original bolt is probably not economically restorable in any practical sense. Not saying that it couldn’t be done, just that it seems like a lot of welding and machining or some kind of retrofit ‘washer’ device (for want of a better term), perhaps silver soldered in place.
I think you should focus on the upside of being “gifted” such a rifle in apparently utilizable condition. The .222 is in any sense to me, a more practical chambering. Perhaps to figure out how to make the magazine function with that round and invest in that direction if desired. Probably not cheap, but likely considerably less expensive than your present quest.
Not to offend, but net, net, I’d probably consider your rifle a simple shooter as is OR a parts gun; the latter IF primarily original in such as receiver, stock and small parts, the sum of those items likely worth more than the whole in its present configuration. Were I imbued with the idea of an original gun, I’d likely sell it and paying the toll for a decent used M 70 in the Hornet. You’ll likely be financially ahead, ostensibly have an ‘original’ rifle and one that should appreciate instead of languishing as an ‘interesting old shooter’ at best.
Whatever… Good luck Sir!
My take
Thank you for the advice. The rifle is a family heirloom I’m not looking to sell. I guess the best advise is to keep shooting .222’s. Thanks for the replies. As always, this site is a great place to get real answers quickly. I appreciate you guys who freely share your expertise.
I won’t dispute any advice that’s already been offered, but I will tell you about my experience restoring a 22 Hornet. I was slugging around a local gun show when I came across a Pre-64 Model 70 project rifle. All that was there was a stripped bare stock (checkering sharp and intact) with no hardware and a complete action, including the bottom metal. I had actually seen this piece at two previous shows and for some reason hadn’t really paid it any attention. Obviously, no one else paid it much attention either because it wasn’t selling. Well, I picked it up and, lo and behold, on closer inspection found it was a complete, unaltered, excellent-condition 22 Hornet action with all the proper supporting pieces. I offered the guy $500 and he snatched it up pronto. I then began a daily search on E-bay for a proper Hornet barrel and, in a little less than a month, came across a takeoff, as-new barrel with a date that’d match my action, which I got for $700. I sent it all off to my brother, a gunsmith, who refinished the stock to factory appearance, found and fit all the accoutrements to the stock, mated the barrel to the action, put it all together, and test fired it….all for $200! The rifle is factory-new looking, shoots well, and functions flawlessly. Total investment: $1400! OK, so I am probably a little more fortunate than most to have a gunsmith in the family. I was also pretty lucky to not only find the as-new barrel with the proper date, but to place the winning bid (although there was no way I was letting it get away). However, if you’re diligent in searching E-Bay and some of the other on-line sites, you can find the parts you want. Then it’s mostly a matter of coming up with the money to pay often extravagant prices. For what it’s worth, I have seen several Pre-64 Hornet barrels for sale since I bought mine, but most were a little worn.
For now, I’d say shoot your rifle and enjoy it as is, but look for parts and, if you can find em, bring your prized heirloom back to its former glory. Either way–leave it as is or restore it–you can’t lose with a Pre-64 Model 70, especially one that’s been in the family and has stories to tell. I have my Grandpa’s Pre-64 Model 70 243 Varmint rifle and wouldn’t trade it for anything. Every time I pick it up, I can see us sitting under a Pennsylvania apple tree on a sunny summer morning picking off groundhogs at ranges that watered my eyes. Grandpa is gone, but the rifle and priceless memories remain.
1 Guest(s)
