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Steve air enough on the “obsessed” observation, and I agree with you… it occupies way more of my time than I ever envisioned! As for being kind to others in using that label… if the shirt fits, wear it!!!
I haven’t seen hide nor hair of Michael either… hopefully he is hiding out somewhere avoiding all the crazies.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Hi all,
The rumors of my demise are highly exaggerated!! I just have been obsessing on other passions in my life. Fly fishing and tying. Bicycle riding. Visiting my daughters who live on opposite sides of Lake Michigan. And definitely staying +6 feet from a world full of crazies of all political persuasions.
Kind of like Bert I have not tried to decipher which style of front sight the carbines may have for the Model 1892 rifles. I can try to go back into my image files for the 91,263 images I have but I am not thinking that it will be extremely helpful that there will be enough of a sample of carbine front sights and decent enough images to accurately determine the style and when/if a change was made.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
Michael –
Nice to see you back and GREAT pictures!
One of the first basic questions I have is, were any Model 1892 carbines built with an integral front sight? Does anyone have an example?
steve004 said
Michael –Nice to see you back and GREAT pictures!
One of the first basic questions I have is, were any Model 1892 carbines built with an integral front sight? Does anyone have an example?
Hi Steve,
Thanks for the kind words. The pics are all iPhone shots. The river is 40 minutes away. 12.5 miles surrounded by state forest. IT’s about a 7 hours fish/row kind of day. I have been on it 3 times and seen a bald eagle each day. And only 6 other canoes!! Darn nice way to NOT be on a computer. The winter wheat field is along one of the many routes I ride usually 3 or 4 days a week. The 116 mile ride is the longest I have done!! That was along 7 and 1/2 hour day of pedaling. The tied up flies are on one of the kitchen window sills in the cottage.
The “early” 1892’s are a bit of a muddy subject. A good portion of the earliest ones used Model 1873 barrels. I own a couple of these and have attached a photo of the front sight on SN 6691 chambered in 44 WCF. I will keep searching my image files and see what drops out and will post them here.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
Michael – your adventures sound a whole lot better than staring into a computer – which I’ve been doing plenty of. A recent neat thing about this thread is that I learned early M1892 barrels were fitted with M1873 barrels. I had no idea. It’s not illogical but I had no clue. Is this both carbine and rifle versions?
As to the question at hand, the image you provide above of a ’92 carbine front sight – I assume that sight is soldered on? And as far as the possibility some ’92 carbines had integral barrel sights, I would assume they wouldn’t be early rifles but of the same manufacture date range of the ’94 carbines made that way?
Hats off to you for 116 mile bike ride! I am certainly not lazy but some days 116 miles in a car seems taxing, let alone peddling.
on the sight topic… all the different small changes always amaze me, I often wonder if it was a way to try and cut costs( whether it be material or labor) different ‘foremen’ of the time, trial and error, or just shear madness! I wonder if there’s a group of old Winchester employees looking down and laughing at all the people obsessed with what they did so long ago?
Bill,
I like the “sheer madness” theory, but I suspect it was all driven by finding ways to reduce costs (labor and material).
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Here are some images of Model 1892 SRC front sights from my files. The image quality is variable but it is all I have.
SN 44873 DOM 1895
SN 45376 DOM 1895
SN 46235 DOM 1895
SN 52712 DOM 1895
SN 52772 DOM 1895
SN 54634 DOM 1896
SN 55767 DOM 1896
SN 60968 DOM 1896
SN 62084 DOM 1896
I will do more as time allows.
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
Thus far, all of the pictures Michael has posted show front sight blocks that were silver soldered to the barrel…
Michael, can you post a batch that were manufactured from 1915 – 1925 ??
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Bert H. said
Thus far, all of the pictures Michael has posted show front sight blocks that were silver soldered to the barrel…Michael, can you post a batch that were manufactured from 1915 – 1925 ??
Bert
Let me see what I can squeeze in later today. Tying up some flies and plan on being on the river tomorrow!! Decisions Decisions!
Michael
Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
twobit said
Let me see what I can squeeze in later today. Tying up some flies and plan on being on the river tomorrow!! Decisions Decisions!
Michael
Its all hearsay unless we see pictures of some nice fish instead of old Winchesters!
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Michael –
As eager as I am to see your carbine photos, stay away from the computer as much as you can. What you are doing is surely vastly better than time in front of an electronic monitor. There will be time for that soon enough. Squeeze all you can out of your adventure.
I pulled a few ’92 carbines out of the safe today. I grabbed my camera and did the best I could. Here is the first one in the 968,xxx range. Madis says c. 1926 and the site here says it was made between 1921 – 1928. I believe this is an integral barrel sight:
Here’s another one. I’m having some difficulty putting it in the same post. Any, this one is 959,xxx range and Madis says c. 1926 and the Winchester site says c. 1921 to 1928. I believe this one is also an integral barrel sight however I don’t think the photos show it as clearly. Well, probably the second photo does:
Here is one in the 916,xxx range. Madis the site here says 1920 manufacture. These photos didn’t turn out as well as I hope. I’m thinking integral barrel sight?
This is an earlier carbine in the 467,xxx range (c. 1908). Theoretically, it would have a silver soldered sight. Apologies for not great photos.
steve004 said
Here’s another one. I’m having some difficulty putting it in the same post. Any, this one is 959,xxx range and Madis says c. 1926 and the Winchester site says c. 1921 to 1928. I believe this one is also an integral barrel sight however I don’t think the photos show it as clearly. Well, probably the second photo does:
Steve,
Based on what I am seeing in your pictures, the sight base was silver soldered to the barrel.
In regards to your pictures, use a flat (not fuzzy) background surface. Find a solid color (medium gray works real well), and go outdoors to take the pictures. If you can find a location not in direct sunlight (bright shade), the pictures will have better contrast resolution.
Here is an example (my back patio area, shaded by three large Western Red Cedar trees)
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
steve004 said
Michael –As eager as I am to see your carbine photos, stay away from the computer as much as you can. What you are doing is surely vastly better than time in front of an electronic monitor. There will be time for that soon enough. Squeeze all you can out of your adventure.
I pulled a few ’92 carbines out of the safe today. I grabbed my camera and did the best I could. Here is the first one in the 968,xxx range. Madis says c. 1926 and the site here says it was made between 1921 – 1928. I believe this is an integral barrel sight:
I’m sorry to confess I still don’t have a grasp of what sights are integral and what are soldered on. The above two photos can help illustrate my confusion. In both of these photos notice the lower edge of the sight where it meets the barrel. There is no edge. Rather, it’s almost like a line of caulk has been smoothed in. On other sights, there’s like a line between the barrel and the sight. Is the carbine in the above photo an example of a soldered on sight – and what I am seeing is the solder filling in where there would otherwise be a distinct 90 degree angle?
Ok, outside this morning in natural light with a white background. I pulled a .32-20 carbine out of the safe. Maybe I finally have it – this is a soldered on sight?
steve004 said
Ok, outside this morning in natural light with a white background. I pulled a .32-20 carbine out of the safe. Maybe I finally have it – this is a soldered on sight?
Correct… silver soldered to the barrel.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
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