Avatar
Search
Forum Scope




Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
Lost password?
sp_Feed sp_PrintTopic sp_TopicIcon
Opinion about a 94 SRC 38-55 on GunsInternational
sp_NewTopic Add Topic
Avatar
Troutdale, OR
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1915
Member Since:
June 26, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
1
June 26, 2013 - 8:29 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

I’m brand new to this forum and wanted to get an opinion from the experts about a 94 SRC in 38-55. I was referred by Bert (thanks Bert!) and got hooked when he referred me to this sight on the subject of the 94/95 variant carbines. I was lucky enough to pick up one of those carbines (in excellent 85-90% condition) a couple of months ago not really knowing about their significance. Anyway, back to this SRC in question. It is a very late production gun (especially for this caliber) that the seller states is 1941 production, but according to Red Book serialization, puts it in the 1940 range. It does have the mysterious "W" below the serial number. It seems to be in nearly new condition with light wear marks from the saddle ring and a little wear on the lever. The stocks look excellent with good fit. Does this gun look legit with original finish on the wood and metal? How common is this configuration for a gun produced so late? I thought the 38-55 caliber was discontinued in 1929–maybe a parts clean-up gun? I’m curious to find out about the front sight, too, since no picture is presented. I’m thinking this would have the post front sight, but is a ramp front sight a possibility? It’s a bit on the pricey side, too. When you’re talking that much money, you want to be sure it’s a good one. Your opinions will be much appreciated.

http://www.gunsinternational.com/WINCHESTER-94-SRC-38-55-PRE-64.cfm?gun_id=100333890

Thanks,
Don

Avatar
Member
WACA Guest
Forum Posts: 77
Member Since:
May 5, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
2
June 26, 2013 - 11:06 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

I think the wood looks off. But let others comment. I did have an issue with that seller. He did make it good. But he wasn’t happy about it.

Avatar
Member
WACA Guest
Forum Posts: 77
Member Since:
May 5, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
3
June 26, 2013 - 11:07 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

If you buy. Use a credif card.

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1388
Member Since:
July 8, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
4
June 27, 2013 - 4:20 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

I have the same questions about this gun. Seems like a later gun to have this configuration. Special ordered?

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 2354
Member Since:
December 31, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
5
June 27, 2013 - 9:05 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Latest SRC I have ever seen. I have a "W" marked carbine # 1264772, PR date 2-3-1941 no ring. Either special order or added later. I also had no idea a 38-55 would be made that late. Big Larry

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 2354
Member Since:
December 31, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
6
June 27, 2013 - 12:19 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Hey Ricky. Do you have a carbine like this one? Bet you don’t. Your buddy, Big Larry

Avatar
Member
WACA Guest
Forum Posts: 81
Member Since:
March 1, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
7
June 27, 2013 - 12:54 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

This seller has sold a lot of questionable guns in the past,rifles with rare calibers that were surveyed in past with different calibers..there is a very good Gunsmith from Montana who makes really nice barrels ,not sure if the two know each other.

JPK

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 2354
Member Since:
December 31, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
8
June 27, 2013 - 3:24 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

And if there was ever a questionable gun ????? Big Larry

Avatar
Kingston, WA
Admin
Forum Posts: 10852
Member Since:
April 15, 2005
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
9
June 27, 2013 - 8:43 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

OK,

First order of business… what is the complete serial number (I can not make it out fully)?

There are a few things that need to be cleared up.

1. Winchester officially discontinued both the 32-40 and 38-55 calibers for the Model 94 as of January 1938 (announced in their catalog).

2. Saddle rings were discontinued as a regular production item in 1932, though they were less common than the Eastern Carbine configuration starting in June of 1929. Saddle rings were a special order option through the start of WW II.

Now, as for that SRC, it is my belief that it is factory original with the possible exception of the barrel, and even it could be original. I very much believe that when Winchester discontinued the 38-55 in January of 1938, that at least a few barrels remained on hand, and were eventually used for parts clean-up. There is a very good possibility that this SRC is legitmate, but I would want to inspect it closely, and check the barrel date. If the 2-digit year number on the barrel is something in the mid 1930s, I would be inclined to believe that it is legitimate. I strongly suspect that it has the traditional post style front sight versus a ramp style (due to the No. 44 rear sight), but I would not be surprised by either style.

In regards to the fit & finish on it, there is nothing about it that would lead me to believe that it is not factory original. In fact, everything I see on the receiver frame screams "original". More specifically, the saddle ring and stud are perfectly oriented, the bitter ends of all the screws are still rounded and they have the typical bluing wear, and the "W" stamp has the expected graying on the periphery (outer edges) of the stamp. The stocks look good to me.

As for the seller, he has had a number of faked 38-55 Model 55 and Model 64 rifles for sale in the past few years, and this gun needs some extra scrutiny, but I would not be willing to summarily dismiss it without first knowing what the exact serial number is, and knowing what the barrel date is.

Bert

WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
High-walls-1-002-C-reduced2.jpg

Avatar
Troutdale, OR
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1915
Member Since:
June 26, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
10
June 27, 2013 - 10:39 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Thanks Bert. I’ll give the seller a call tomorrow to find out the complete serial number and verify the front sight. I have my doubts that he’ll be willing to remove the forearm to find the date stamp though, but I’ll ask. I’ll report back my findings.

Avatar
Wyoming - Gods Country
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1271
Member Since:
January 26, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
11
June 27, 2013 - 10:43 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

SN looks like 1,220,??? to me

                                                                               ~Gary~

                                                                                                                                                                              94-SRR.jpg

Avatar
Member
WACA Guest
Forum Posts: 81
Member Since:
March 1, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
12
June 28, 2013 - 5:28 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

I personally do not like the way the buttstock fits,in the the photo of the right side, the stock travels below the receiver, and it just isnt tight enough anywhere along the receiver on either side, and even along the upper tang it fits but it doesn’t look flush.And i also don’t like the color of the wood very much,it,s to light.The receiver it self looks perfect….This seller has had to many rare caliber 94,s 55,s and 64,s that weren’t factory for sale in the past for me to believe this one is factory

John k.

Avatar
Troutdale, OR
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1915
Member Since:
June 26, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
13
June 28, 2013 - 11:28 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

I just got off the phone with the seller. Apparently, the gun has been shipped to someone in Texas to look at. He said it had the post front sight with a blade, but that’s all the information he could give me since the gun wasn’t in the shop. Is anyone on this forum the person that this was shipped to?

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 2306
Member Since:
March 20, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
14
June 28, 2013 - 11:46 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Hello,

I live in Texas but it is NOT coming to me.

Michael

Signature-Pic.jpg

 

Model 1892 / Model 61 Collector, Research, Valuation

Avatar
Troutdale, OR
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1915
Member Since:
June 26, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
15
June 28, 2013 - 12:21 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

If only it were a 1892 with SN 6420, right?

Avatar
Member
WACA Guest
Forum Posts: 81
Member Since:
November 17, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
16
June 28, 2013 - 12:22 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

To me something just didn’t seem right about the looks of this gun?
It may just be the poor pictures or my failing eye sight but it appears
to me that there is a unusually wide gap between the magazine and the
barrel. This may just be me?

Avatar
Troutdale, OR
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 1915
Member Since:
June 26, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
17
June 28, 2013 - 8:51 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

I appreciate everyone’s input on this rifle. I’m getting a little bit of a bad vibe about things not adding up completely without being able to verify it in person. With other members sharing instances of this seller selling fraudulent guns in the past gives me a really bad taste in my mouth and am not willing to shell out six grand with too many potential open-ended issues. I think Bert’s advice of examining the date stamp underneath the forearm would help answer the legitimacy head on, but it’s highly unlikely we’ll get anything from the seller on that. Also, who’s to say the barrel stamps can’t be faked either. With that in mind, here’s another few examples that just seem "too good to be true" (at least to me) from this seller. How would anyone be able to come across such mint condition guns if there wasn’t a little bit of funky something going on. In this case, the sellers past fishy reputation means a lot.

http://www.gunsinternational.com/WINCHESTER-06-DELUXE-22-S-L-LR.cfm?gun_id=100349909

http://www.gunsinternational.com/WINCHESTER-62A-GALLERY-ROLL-STAMP-22-SHORT.cfm?gun_id=100352126

http://www.gunsinternational.com/WINCHESTER-62A-GALLERY-ROLL-STAMP-22-SHORT.cfm?gun_id=100349912

http://www.gunsinternational.com/WINCHESTER-62A-DELUXE-ROLL-STAMP-22-S-L-LR.cfm?gun_id=100350162

http://www.gunsinternational.com/WINCHESTER-61-GALLERY-ROLL-STAMP-22-SHORT.cfm?gun_id=100352123

Avatar
Oregon
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 479
Member Since:
September 29, 1993
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
18
June 29, 2013 - 11:01 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Big Larry:

Big Larry:

No, I have 35 carbines but none like this one! Don’t believe that I ever will either. Take a look at the butt-stock. That style went out of production around serial number 1130000 in June of 1936 when the serrated steel butt-plate was introduced.

Too many "coincidences" for me……………

WACA Life Benefactor Member

NRA Life Member

Avatar
Member
WACA Member
Forum Posts: 2354
Member Since:
December 31, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
19
June 29, 2013 - 2:33 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Me too Rick. If you don’t like it, neither do I. You be the GUHRU. Larry

Avatar
Member
WACA Guest
Forum Posts: 81
Member Since:
March 1, 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
20
June 29, 2013 - 2:44 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print sp_QuotePost

Deerhunter,

I compared the Winchester red letter roll stamp on the seller,s rifle to the model 61 roll stamp shown in Ned Schwings reference on page 61,and the top of the letter s and t are very close together on the seller,s rifle and in the reference book there is a much greater separation.

John K

Forum Timezone: UTC 0
Most Users Ever Online: 778
Currently Online: Bert H., Bill Hockett, steve004, wally, Chuck, clarence, Nevada Paul, 86Win, SureShot
Guest(s) 179
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
clarence: 6389
TXGunNut: 5057
Chuck: 4601
1873man: 4323
steve004: 4261
Big Larry: 2354
twobit: 2306
mrcvs: 1727
TR: 1725
Forum Stats:
Groups: 1
Forums: 17
Topics: 12789
Posts: 111406

 

Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 1770
Members: 8873
Moderators: 4
Admins: 3
Navigation