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Does any body know why Winchester chose the Krag 1901 sight for their 22 cal. Winder muskets?? The sight was not intended for use in that cal. It just doesn’t make much sense to me. Any ideas???
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Jeff,
At the time that Winchester introduced the Winder Musket (January of 1904), the Springfield Krag Rifle was still our primary military long arm. The Winder Musket was marketed to be a military marksmanship training rifle, and the Krag Model 1901 sight was chosen because it would be very familiar to the troops. Surprisingly, it works quite well with the 22 LR cartridge.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
Are the Krag 1901 sights on the Winders "original" Krags or have they been altered to fit the taper and size of the #3 barrels??
Jeff,
The Winder Musket barrels are not a standard No. 3 as found on the Sporting Rifles. The contour is slightly smaller. I suspect (but do not know for sure), that the sight is unaltered from the original Krag rifles. Is there a specific reason you are asking?
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
I am a shooter & a Winder enthusiast. I have a 3rd Model Winder fitted with a 2nd Model barrel. A 1901 Krag sight fits exactly into the holes drilled & tapped at the factory. I tried this for a spell, but the Lyman sight on the 3rd Model is far superior. Original barrel on the 3rd Model was pitted & shot out. The replacement came from an old gunsmith’s stash. The original 2nd Model probably became a varmint rifle.
Was the Winder Musket barrel listed as a 2 1/2 ?
The whole history of smallbore military training rifles and the development of the Winder is somewhat complicated, involving Harry Pope, the J. Stevens Arms & Tool Co., Springfield Armory and US Army & National Guard politics as well as Charles Winder. It somewhat resembles a miniature version of Boeing vs Airbus for the new USAF air refueling tanker.
If you suspect that the Krag 1901 sight used on the Winder was unaltered or milled , than that would leave me to believe that the contours of the 30-40 Krag rifle are the same or very close to the Winder barrel dimensions. Yes maybe??
jeff said
If you suspect that the Krag 1901 sight used on the Winder was unaltered or milled , than that would leave me to believe that the contours of the 30-40 Krag rifle are the same or very close to the Winder barrel dimensions. Yes maybe??
Yes.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
waterman said
Was the Winder Musket barrel listed as a 2 1/2 ?
No, it was not.
The standard No. 3 barrel measures 1.05" at the receiver, and .90" at the muzzle. It has a .005/inch taper.
The standard No. 2 barrel measures 1.00" at the receiver, and has the same .005/inch taper rate, resulting in a .88/.87/.86/.85 inch muzzle diameter for barrel lengths 24/26/28/30 inches respectively.
The Winder Musket barrels measure 1.03" at the receiver, and have a .01/inch taper rate, resulting in a muzzle diameter of .72".
As you can see, the taper rate for the Musket barrels is 2X that of a standard barrel, and the muzzle diameter is significantly smaller than the No. 2 barrel.
Bert
WACA Historian & Board of Director Member #6571L
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