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I have a 1894 td rifle in 38-55 serial 237285 that has an obviously replaced barrel, the caliber and barrel address are to the side of the barrel instead of on top. The barrel has the circled P and the WP mark ahead of the receiver and the receiver has the WP proof. What say the group, was this replacement done by Winchester?
mark minnillo said
I have a 1894 td rifle in 38-55 serial 237285 that has an obviously replaced barrel, the caliber and barrel address are to the side of the barrel instead of on top. The barrel has the circled P and the WP mark ahead of the receiver and the receiver has the WP proof. What say the group, was this replacement done by Winchester?
Check the bottom of the brl for the “mail-order” marks that would indicate a non-factory replacement. They are “OF” (for outside-fitted) or (after 1913) a “P” within a circle. If you don’t find either of those, it may be a factory replacement.
Online
The circled P indicates it was a mail order barrel, so likely replaced by an outside factory gunsmith.
Don
deerhunter said
The circled P indicates it was a mail order barrel, so likely replaced by an outside factory gunsmith.Don
I understand that the circled P indicates mail order or replacement but what about the fact that the barrel and receiver (which would not have been WP marked originally) are both stamped with the WP mark??
deerhunter said
The circled P indicates it was a mail order barrel, so likely replaced by an outside factory gunsmith.Don
Neither one of those marks on the top of the brl look original to me. (And what’s the “X”?) I thought the circled P was marked on the underside, like the “OF” mark.
clarence said
deerhunter said
The circled P indicates it was a mail order barrel, so likely replaced by an outside factory gunsmith.
Don
Neither one of those marks on the top of the brl look original to me. (And what’s the “X”?) I thought the circled P was marked on the underside, like the “OF” mark.
I have seen other barrels with the circled P on top of the barrel but not with the WP mark
Marks do look a little strange to me too. Either way this was most likely not done by Winchester.
Chuck said
Marks do look a little strange to me too. Either way this was most likely not done by Winchester.
Applying faked markings merely draws attention to the brl replacement, which might have gone unnoticed by someone unaware of the change to off-side markings. Suspect it’s not a mail-order, but merely a brl removed from another ’94. So why go to the trouble to add crudely faked markings? Because there’s no accounting for the stupidity of many in this racket.
clarence said
Chuck said
Marks do look a little strange to me too. Either way this was most likely not done by Winchester.
Applying faked markings merely draws attention to the brl replacement, which might have gone unnoticed by someone unaware of the change to off-side markings. Suspect it’s not a mail-order, but merely a brl removed from another ’94. So why go to the trouble to add crudely faked markings? Because there’s no accounting for the stupidity of many in this racket.
Nice!
clarence said
Chuck said
Marks do look a little strange to me too. Either way this was most likely not done by Winchester.
Applying faked markings merely draws attention to the brl replacement, which might have gone unnoticed by someone unaware of the change to off-side markings. Suspect it’s not a mail-order, but merely a brl removed from another ’94. So why go to the trouble to add crudely faked markings? Because there’s no accounting for the stupidity of many in this racket.
Are you saying both the circle P and the WP marks are all fake??
If the factory replaced a barrel and they were using a already (oval P) mail order marked barrel from stock they would also add the WP to both the new barrel and the receiver if done after 1906 when PW’s were in use.
However the OP’s guns markings are so crude it is hard to believe Winchester did them.
Here’s a long discussion from a few years ago regarding this topic:
https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/the-winchester-wp-and-oval-p-markings/
Don
deerhunter said
Here’s a long discussion from a few years ago regarding this topic:https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-rifles/the-winchester-wp-and-oval-p-markings/
Don
Deerhunter,
I just got done going through that thread. Very interesting stuff. In 1892takedown’s initial post he supposes that guns with the WP on the barrel and receiver, and the oval P on the barrel would signify a parts barrel installed by Winchester. I think this was disproven further down in the post.
There’s also an example on page 26 of the most recent Winchester Collector magazine:
https://winchestercollector.org/magazines/202209/28/
Don
mark minnillo said Are you saying both the circle P and the WP marks are all fake??
I’m saying that look fake. Stranger looking even than a double strike by a careless workman.
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